intermittent failure to start - Page 2 - Toyota RAV4 Forums
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#11 (permalink) Old 02-10-2012, 02:07 PM
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Wow carbon, that goes back to the very beginning when electronic ignition first came out as a replacement for points. I don't remember when flyweights and vacuum solenoids were replaced by electronic timing controls.

The other issue which may be affecting dick04's RAV is the pulsers for the injectors are usually also located in the distributor base.

Edit: The pulsers are called "G sensors" on page 5 of the tutorial.
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#12 (permalink) Old 02-10-2012, 02:17 PM
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Do 99 have a distributor? I was thinking they had coil packs without distributor,very well could be wrong though.
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#13 (permalink) Old 02-10-2012, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hd72m View Post
Do 99 have a distributor? I was thinking they had coil packs without distributor,very well could be wrong though.
I don't know for sure. I took my queue from the first video here:
GINGER'S 1999 Rav-4 "Custom TRUE Cold-Air-Intake System!!!"
with the ignition wires going down under the intake I assumed they go to a distributor. Could go to coil packs but I don't know why they be located down there. Come to think of it OHC engines usually mount their distributors on the end of the camshaft. So maybe I typed all this for nothin' ! Shuudda looked at my father-in-law gen 4.1 when I went out for lunch!
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#14 (permalink) Old 02-10-2012, 09:06 PM
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I think after 97 they changed to coil pack.
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#15 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 05:59 AM
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Fred,
Not knowledgeable enough tho! Yes it is crank and no start and so far, after time and from hot and cold starts and runs normally. My car early 2000 does not have the modern DIS (distributorless ignition system) where each plug has its own coil and igniter and no waste spark. 1998-2000 cars have an early DIS system where a two coil and igniter packs are mounted away from the cylinders and each serve two cylinders and sparks one on the compression stroke and the other (1-4 and 3.2) on the exhaust stroke (hence the term waste spark)
These packs are not easy to access and my question is how and where does one find an intermittent fault in this area. I had thought maybe someone could say yes such and such a part often fails. My only other option seems to be replace both packs and hope that is where the problem is or wait until I have complete failure.
Any help welcome
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#16 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 07:01 AM
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It seems hard to believe that both sets of coils would go bad here and there so if you check spark at all 4 plugs and you have none it is not the coils,then you need to go backwards if the coils are grounded. A couple times in the past I remember seeing bad grounding of the coils found to be there trouble.
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#17 (permalink) Old 02-11-2012, 10:01 AM
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dicko4,
Maybe not knowledgeable enough yet but you're gaining and that's good to see.

I agree with hd72m both coils are unlikely to fail and then come back to life. If one coil was bad the engine would probably still start on the other so it's probably a common issue. After you check the grounds including the battery-to-body and battery-to-block ones, the crankshaft position sensor would be next on my list. It has minimum output at slow speed (cranking) which is why the engine could still run fine once it starts.
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#18 (permalink) Old 02-21-2012, 01:50 PM
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Garage
i thought when the coil packs go bad they just completly die, with no intermittent issues, due to them trying to jump the increased gap by amplifying voltage. i suppose i could be wrong. what kind of plugs are you using at the moment?

yeah she may not be the most beautiful thing out there, however I wouldn't trade her for anything. There simply is no light SUV comparison. Go ahead Bluebook it... there's a damn good reason why they hold their value so well
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#19 (permalink) Old 02-24-2012, 09:52 AM
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dick04,
I don't think its the coils... if you have a multimeter then there are some tests you can do, look on here Automotive Training and Resource Site sorry I cannot remember what the readings should be but if you look long enough you will find them on autoshop.
I would suggest that it is the cam sensor that is at fault, you can find it on the back of the cylinder head, left side (oil filler cap side), one 8mm wrench and pull the plug will have it removed.
You will find that it is covered in gunk, probably from the cambelt!!, clean it first, check and see if it still has a magnetic pull and if you have a multimeter check it for resistence, I think I read that it should be 1000 ohms but check autoshop again.
I have heard of problems on other cars where the car starts when cold but refuses to start again when hot. The owners have removed the cam sensor and put it in the fridge and once cooled refitted it and the car starts, no idea why, do't ask me!
Also I believe that the motor needs the cam sensor to start but it is redundant after that, at least until the next time.
Good luck
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#20 (permalink) Old 02-25-2012, 03:39 PM
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I just joined this Rav4 forum after owning a 2010 since late 09. No problems yet - just trying to figure out what the drive axel bolt is and what the correct torque for it is. Obviously I don't know much about Toyotas yet but the symtoms you describe in this thread sound very similar to a common problem on older Hondas. They have what is commonly called a "Main Relay". It is energized by the ignition switch and controls the power to the Fuel pump. The relay will get sticky and intermittent (never fails when the vehicle is running but occasionaly the fuel pump contacts won't make contact when the relay is energized). It doesn't seem to matter how many times you try, the fuel pump just wont come on - at least not until you let it set for an hour (sometimes a day) and then when you try again its as if nothing is wrong. Most vehicles will energize the fuel pump for a couple seconds when you switch the ignition "on" but not to "start". If you don't hear the pump run when you first switch the ignition on, this could be your problem. MY 2010 Rav4 has the keyless ignition so this test doesn't work for it. Another positive way to test is to find and disconnect the fuel pump electrical connector. Then check between the vehicle side of the connector and chassis ground with a voltmeter while starting the engine. You should see 12 volts on at least one of the leads. If not, you'll need to check the electrical circuit with a good circuit diagram from a Haynes or Chilton manual. None of the suggested problems in the other posts seem to fit your symptoms. These are not problems that are intermittent (runs perfectly and then doesn't start at all) Good Luck!
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