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Front brake shudder/jitter 2006 Limited 4 cyl

8K views 21 replies 10 participants last post by  KSNancy 
#1 ·
Hi guys,

Are the front brakes on the RAV especially susceptible to jitter/shuddering? I don't want to call it "warped rotors" because I'm pretty sure that a truly warped rotor would affect handling even when brakes aren't applied, what I am talking about happens only while braking, and is much more pronounced when going downhill (when the weight is distributed more toward the front).

I have read about how cementite forms on the rotor surface from deposition of brake pad material when hot but there is quite a bit of driving on hills where I live, I don't know how to apply my brakes to avoid this without driving unsafely-- when ya gotta stop (and stay stopped), ya gotta stop, right?

I had the rotors turned once which helped but it is happening again and starting to get annoying again. If I have to pop for new rotors I would like to know if there is anything I can do (by selection of materials or by driving style) to prevent this the next time around?

Thanks,

Matt
 
#2 ·
I had the same issue in my Kia Spectra this year and within a month it became really bad.
My first thought was warped rotors although I could not understand how you could possibly warp a rotor on that car.

So I went ahead and simply relubricated the caliper pins and put some lube around the edges of the brake pads (I did change their sides i.e in to out and vice-versa). I did that one wheel and the shudder was gone!

Of course, I serviced the other side too. I did not even touch the rotors.

BTW, are you using OEM brake pads (Advics) ?
 
#3 ·
Thanks for the reply.

I haven't been wrenching on this vehicle yet because I want to keep the Gold warranty in effect and not have any issues with Toyota, since I have owned it only they have touched it and based on the previous owner's service records I am pretty sure she didn't let anyone else touch it, either.

So basically I don't know the answer to your question it's either what was original equipment when it was assembled in Japan or what Johnson's Toyota put in as part of routine maintenance.

I think I might see if your suggestion will work for my RAV, I don't have a place to work on it but my brother in law does so maybe I can feed him some BBQ and use his floorjack to have a look

Thanks,

Matt
 
#6 ·
Hi AVS,

While I did not do this specifically I have had the tires rotated twice by the dealer and the symptom has not changed so I am guessing that just retorquing lug nuts won't lead us anywhere...but I'll try it anyway when I can. Nothing like "free" :)


Thanks,

Matt
 
#7 ·
I don't want to call it "warped rotors" because I'm pretty sure that a truly warped rotor would affect handling even when brakes aren't applied, what I am talking about happens only while braking, and is much more pronounced when going downhill (when the weight is distributed more toward the front).
Actually those symptoms do point to warped rotors since warped ones have virtually no effect on handling when not braking.
 
#9 ·
If the shudder only happens when the brakes are applied, there is something happening differently at the moment of application than at other times. If the rotors were actually warped, wouldn't that cause the wheel to wobble worse as a factor of speed, as if it were our of balance?

I had always thought "warp" also, but have been doing a lot of reading on the subject and, at least according to the articles I have found referencing current information it seems that it may not be the problem that it once was:

Raybestos Brake Tech School, Part One: Rotors Don't Warp | Hendon Publishing

There's no such thing as 'warped' brake rotors - Orlando Autos | Examiner.com

Respecting a difference of opinions on the matter, let me rephrase the question: is there something about the RAV that makes it more susceptible to shudder under braking than other vehicles?

Thanks,

Matt
 
#11 · (Edited)
If the shudder only happens when the brakes are applied, there is something happening differently at the moment of application than at other times. If the rotors were actually warped, wouldn't that cause the wheel to wobble worse as a factor of speed, as if it were our of balance?
It is true that what's called warping actually isn't a bending of the surface it's variation in thickness often due to an extended time parked in a high moisture area. The rotors rust everywhere but under the pads. Then when you drive the rust quickly wears off leaving most of the surface slightly thinner than the area that was protected but the pads. As the pads ride over this area when the brakes are applied a thumping noise and vibration occurs.
 
#10 ·
Another thing you can check is when you installed new rotor, you're suppose to match up the "marking" on the rotor with the "marking" on the wheel hub. The "marking" is usually mark with yellow or white paint indicating high spot on the wheel hub and the rotor. By matching up the "marking" your runout variation should be at a minimum. Not every rotor have this marking. You can also try lining up different rotor holes to different wheel studs and see which one gives you the smallest runout or the least jittering but make sure you give the wheel hub a good sanding before you install the rotor.
 
#12 ·
Interesting. I've never heard of or done any matching, just plunked the new or machined old rotors on. I do make sure there's no rust or debris on the hub, but that's about it. Since it's a much smaller diameter than the wheel & tire it seems to me a rotor would have to have a whole lot of runout to affect the overall balance.
 
#18 ·
Years ago, I had this problem after getting new tires on a Mustang. Turns out they air gunned the lug nuts unevenly, causing the wheel itself to warp slightly. Took it back and insisted they hand tighten the lug nuts with a torque wrench in the proper star pattern, and the problem went away.
 
#21 ·
I've had this issue with the shop I've dealt with for years. He insists his guys tighten the lugs correctly, evenly etc, even though I find differently. Since his shop is excellent in all other aspects, I find it's easier(and puts my mind at ease)to just loosen and retorque the lugs when I get it home. Life's too short!
 
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