Toyota RAV4 Forums banner
Cancel
Create thread New Garage Forums

Rust Cure Formula 3000 causing strut mount noise on bumpy roads. How to clean it without affecting the rubber?

Jump to Latest
1 - 14 of 14 Posts

vmmf

· Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Discussion starter · #1 · (Edited)
I drive a Toyota RAV 4 2013 LE FWD which has 145 000 km (90k miles). When you open the hood panel, the car has 2 covers over the top part of the strut mount support (#9 on the image). I saw that there was some rust there and spray them (perhaps too gently) with Rust Cure Formula 3000, I also sprayed other parts of the engine bay where rust was starting to appear. A couple of days later while driving through a bumpy road I had taken a week before I noticed an uncomfortable noise from frontal suspension which did not exist before. The label for Rust Cure Formula 3000 says it is safe for rubber parts but I'm wondering if it made the rubber seals in the strut mount support become soft. Is there any way to clean this? I wouldn't want to put brake cleaner there because it says it damages rubber. I'm thinking more in a de-greaser safe on rubber. Could this seals regain their original strength and be fixed or I pretty much have to replace the strut mount supports?

I couldn't find anything on Rust Cure Formula 3000 can saying not to add it to the suspension. Perhaps this is something experts know but I'm a learning DIY

Other than the noise. Is there any safety issues for having this problem?

Edit: It is my believe that these components have never been replaced. It is an 145 000 km (90k miles) car with mostly highway miles which almost never goes off road

Thank you

171207
the cover plates that are found over the strut mount support
 
#2 ·
Suspension Components, including strut mount are WEAR items.

When was the last time the front and rear struts were replaced? When the fronts are replaced, the front strut mounts are supposed to be replaced at the same time too.

To maintain optimum handling and shortest braking distances, struts/shocks should be replaced every 5yr/50,000miles.
 
#4 ·
No official change interval by Toyota, other than the usual inspect suspension components, periodically.

Strut/shock manufactures recommend this. I used to believe it was for their own self interest, until I changed my struts & shocks myself.

I was amazed at the degradation in the components. When front strut assembly was disassembled, the front strut took over a minute to go from compression to a full extension. The new strut only took 7seconds! The rear shocks took over 5 minutes to go from compression to a full extension. New shocks only took 7 seconds too.

I noticed no driveabilty issues on the clearly worn out struts/shocks. No tire hopscotch marks on any tires. Brakes worked, but I clearly had long braking distances.

All of this makes sense if you think about the reality. You drive the vehicle daily/regularly. The sturts/shock wear out over time. You won't notice the degradation, since you experience the degradation daily and get accustomed to the degradation. Only way to know the difference is if you had an identical car that was never driven so you can compare the driveabilty differences. I'm sure you would feel the difference immediately.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
NameofUser said:
No official change interval by Toyota, other than the usual inspect suspension components, periodically.

Strut/shock manufactures recommend this. I used to believe it was for their own self interest, until I changed my struts & shocks myself.

I was amazed at the degradation in the components. When front strut assembly was disassembled, the front strut took over a minute to go from compression to a full extension. The new strut only took 7seconds! The rear shocks took over 5 minutes to go from compression to a full extension. New shocks only took 7 seconds too.

I noticed no driveabilty issues on the clearly worn out struts/shocks. No tire hopscotch marks on any tires. Brakes worked, but I clearly had long braking distances.

All of this makes sense if you think about the reality. You drive the vehicle daily/regularly. The sturts/shock wear out over time. You won't notice the degradation, since you experience the degradation daily and get accustomed to the degradation. Only way to know the difference is if you had an identical car that was never driven so you can compare the driveabilty differences. I'm sure you would feel the difference immediately.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much for your thoughts. What do you think about KYB complete strut assembly? I would like to install the struts myself but I don't have a way to compress the spring and this unit comes in one piece. What did you use when you installed your own struts?
 
#6 ·
You can get free loaner tools (strut/shock spring compressor) from the big auto parts retailers in USA. I imagine the big CAN auto parts store have similar/same loaner tool program.

KYB is supposedly OEM supplier for Toyota. People report KYB having a firmer/harder ride, while Monroe has a softer ride.

Warranty is the big difference. KYB has LIFETIME warranty for defects only. Monroe has LIFETIME on defects AND normal wear! If Monroe maintains that policy, you could swap out struts/shocks every 5years! You'll definetly/maintain optimum handling and BRAKING chareristics, assuming other suspension components are good. Wish I knew this when I replaced mine, as I got KYB.

The big problem w/ complete assemblies is parts used may be of lesser quality than the traditional replacement route. Also, the spring is often times incorrect for your particular vehicle (too strong), b/c the completes are made to fit as many vehicles as possible to save on cost.

Do avoid compete assemblies from no name brands like Unity on Amazon and fleaBay. Cheap and you absolutely get what you pay for.
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
NameofUser said:
You can get free loaner tools (strut/shock spring compressor) from the big auto parts retailers in USA. I imagine the big CAN auto parts store have similar/same loaner tool program.

KYB is supposedly OEM supplier for Toyota. People report KYB having a firmer/harder ride, while Monroe has a softer ride.

Warranty is the big difference. KYB has LIFETIME warranty for defects only. Monroe has LIFETIME on defects AND normal wear! If Monroe maintains that policy, you could swap out struts/shocks every 5years! You'll definetly/maintain optimum handling and BRAKING chareristics, assuming other suspension components are good. Wish I knew this when I replaced mine, as I got KYB.

The big problem w/ complete assemblies is parts used may be of lesser quality than the traditional replacement route. Also, the spring is often times incorrect for your particular vehicle (too strong), b/c the completes are made to fit as many vehicles as possible to save on cost.

Do avoid compete assemblies from no name brands like Unity on Amazon and fleaBay. Cheap and you absolutely get what you pay for.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much for your great tips! I have to find if I can loan such tools. I live on a small rural town perhaps someone can rent them to me. I'm truly amazed about normal wear warranty in Monroe. i wonder if to get that you have to buy directly from them and be in US.

I will definitively check into traditional replacement. So even within KYB traditional replacement is better than complete assemblies?

What is a good strut/shock spring compressor you could recommend?

Thank you
 
#8 ·
You will have to see what the warranty is for Monroe products in Canada; hopefully the same lifetime warranty even for normal wear and tear.

I don't know if KYB does complete assemblies like Monroe. I'm sure they do though.

Individual KYB components better than Monroe complete assemblies? That will be a judgement call. Remember, KYB =firm/hard ride vs Monroe=softer ride. Some people HATE Monroe b/c "too soft."
KYB vs Monroe warranty is a BIG DIFFERENCE. You will have to decide if you want a "softer" ride and LIFETIME warranty that covers normal wear and tear (if Monroe Canada has the same US warranty).

Spring Compressor
If you have money to burn and wall space, Branick makes the best strut/shock spring compressor. ($800+ NEW). They also have a floor stand for this wall mount too.
www.branick.com

Model 7600 Professional Strut Spring Compression Tool - Branick

Known as "the standard in the industry," the 7600 handles the heaviest coil-over-shocks on light trucks and SUVs without needing additional adapters. It also has longer handles for extra torque. The multi-position upper spring hooks can be arranged for ultimate flexibility to fit "factory" coil...
www.branick.com www.branick.com

Poor mans spring compressor ($33, Harbor Freight); many knock offs of this design style.
Sames style/design on Amazon, with links to other identical spring compressor design for less money.
www.amazon.com

Amazon.com: Orion Motor Tech Spring Compressor, 11.5" Universal Coil Spring Compressor, Heavy Duty Strut Compressor for Car Truck ATV UTV Motorcycle, Spring Compressor Tool Automotive 1/2" Drive, 13/16" Hex : Automotive

Buy Orion Motor Tech Spring Compressor, 11.5" Universal Coil Spring Compressor, Heavy Duty Strut Compressor for Car Truck ATV UTV Motorcycle, Spring Compressor Tool Automotive 1/2" Drive, 13/16" Hex: Strut Compressors - Amazon.com âś“ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
NameofUser said:
You will have to see what the warranty is for Monroe products in Canada; hopefully the same lifetime warranty even for normal wear and tear.

I don't know if KYB does complete assemblies like Monroe. I'm sure they do though.

Individual KYB components better than Monroe complete assemblies? That will be a judgement call. Remember, KYB =firm/hard ride vs Monroe=softer ride. Some people HATE Monroe b/c "too soft."
KYB vs Monroe warranty is a BIG DIFFERENCE. You will have to decide if you want a "softer" ride and LIFETIME warranty that covers normal wear and tear (if Monroe Canada has the same US warranty).

Spring Compressor
If you have money to burn and wall space, Branick makes the best strut/shock spring compressor. ($800+ NEW). They also have a floor stand for this wall mount too.
www.branick.com

Model 7600 Professional Strut Spring Compression Tool - Branick

Known as "the standard in the industry," the 7600 handles the heaviest coil-over-shocks on light trucks and SUVs without needing additional adapters. It also has longer handles for extra torque. The multi-position upper spring hooks can be arranged for ultimate flexibility to fit "factory" coil...
www.branick.com www.branick.com

Poor mans spring compressor ($33, Harbor Freight); many knock offs of this design style.
Sames style/design on Amazon, with links to other identical spring compressor design for less money.
www.amazon.com

Amazon.com: Orion Motor Tech Spring Compressor, 11.5" Universal Coil Spring Compressor, Heavy Duty Strut Compressor for Car Truck ATV UTV Motorcycle, Spring Compressor Tool Automotive 1/2" Drive, 13/16" Hex : Automotive

Buy Orion Motor Tech Spring Compressor, 11.5" Universal Coil Spring Compressor, Heavy Duty Strut Compressor for Car Truck ATV UTV Motorcycle, Spring Compressor Tool Automotive 1/2" Drive, 13/16" Hex: Strut Compressors - Amazon.com âś“ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com
Click to expand...
If you had to describe the feel between hard and soft ride to a person that has never felt the difference what would you say?

I read in a post that the Toyota OEM struts are KYB . If this is true it would be the only thing I know and I really like it compare to the ride of a small sedan car which feels very bumpy.

What does the soft ride feels like?

Thank you for sharing the tools. I'm not a professional mechanic so I will choose the cheap ones. Are they safe though? I don't want the spring jumping on me
 
#10 ·
the squeak may be caused by rubber parts moving a bit now, whearas they would have been stationery before the lube was applied.

shocks can last 200,000km or be wrecked in a weekend, depends on the terrain. hi speed on rough roads will wear them out. I have experienced that Monroe don't last long, KYB do.
There will be loads of replacement springs to choose from. Measure your wire diameter, nr of coils, whether you have progressive rate, smaller wire dia at the ends, then compare with the candidate replacements.
basically, thinner wire will be softer. more coils will be softer.
The cheapest springs won't be progressive rate.
anti corrosion coating is important, otherwise they will corrode and break.
 
Discussion starter · #11 ·
Jack Daniels said:
the squeak may be caused by rubber parts moving a bit now, whearas they would have been stationery before the lube was applied.

shocks can last 200,000km or be wrecked in a weekend, depends on the terrain. hi speed on rough roads will wear them out. I have experienced that Monroe don't last long, KYB do.
There will be loads of replacement springs to choose from. Measure your wire diameter, nr of coils, whether you have progressive rate, smaller wire dia at the ends, then compare with the candidate replacements.
basically, thinner wire will be softer. more coils will be softer.
The cheapest springs won't be progressive rate.
anti corrosion coating is important, otherwise they will corrode and break.
Click to expand...
I almost never go off road. Highway most of the time.

Have you been able to replace your worn out Monroes on warranty?

Do you know if KYB is Toyota OEM?

Thank you for your explanation. I didn't know about progressive rate

Regarding the noise I fastened all the bolts according to Toyota torque specs and put thread lock on them. I also added a special rubber lubricating spray on the strut mounts which also has a cleaning action and got rid of the rust cure 3000 . The noise went away 90% but I'm sure it will return as soon as that spray dries.
 
#12 ·
Firm (KYB) vs soft (Monroe) would be your small "bumpy" sedan analogy. Now as the KYB wears, the ride will "soften" over time. The true comparison of KYB vs Monroe would be to have TWO identical cars in every aspect (age, mileage, weight), BUT the only difference would be the struts/shocks: KYB on one, Monroe on the other.

You are over thinking the strut/shock replacement. Its a wear item, that needs replacement, like tires. If you are NOT happy w/ a set of tires you recently got, its not the end of the world as that tires will need to be replaced soon enough. You will be sure NOT to get that same model or maker when the time comes.

If you want OPTIMUM handling and MINIMUM braking distance, you replace every 5yr/50k miles. Very few people do this. When you take your struts/shocks off, and if you disassemble them, you will see that they are quite worn, based on the time each takes to return from compression to a full extension.

The DIY spring compression tools are safe if used properly. There are a lot of YT videos of people using it; many are using the tool incorrectly w/ an impact wrench to save time.
*The strut/shock should be mounted in a bench vise grip.
*Wear eye protection.
*Position the tool on opposite ends.
*Use a hand ratchet and apply equal amount of turns to the nut on the compression tool, on each side equally, in an alternating fashion. IE, half turn on side 1, go to other side and apply a half turns on side 2. Repeat this process unltill spring compresses enough to remove strut/shock. One side may need more turns than the other; this would be normal b/c its a spring and the sides are not equal in length. The tool may move, a little from being exactly 180degree apart. This would be normal. If the tool moves a lot, you should uncompress and reposition. You can try applying locking pliers to the spring and the thick black metal part of the tool, or on each side of the black metal part, so the tool doesn't move.

You can always take the old strut/shock assembly to a auto shop and they can dissasemble the old worn assembly and reassemble w/ the new parts (if you do the individual components) for a small fee. Pricing now my be $40/assembly.

STOP asking what the warranty details of KYB/Monroe are. You need to read the black/white text of the two companies strut/shock warranty policy yourself, or contact the company. Someone could be mistaken/lying, or the policy could have recently changed for the better or worse. Different countries will have different policies. Time for you to do some easy DIY and read the details of what is and is NOT covered under warranty.
 
Discussion starter · #13 · (Edited)
NameofUser said:
Firm (KYB) vs soft (Monroe) would be your small "bumpy" sedan analogy. Now as the KYB wears, the ride will "soften" over time. The true comparison of KYB vs Monroe would be to have TWO identical cars in every aspect (age, mileage, weight), BUT the only difference would be the struts/shocks: KYB on one, Monroe on the other.

You are over thinking the strut/shock replacement. Its a wear item, that needs replacement, like tires. If you are NOT happy w/ a set of tires you recently got, its not the end of the world as that tires will need to be replaced soon enough. You will be sure NOT to get that same model or maker when the time comes.

If you want OPTIMUM handling and MINIMUM braking distance, you replace every 5yr/50k miles. Very few people do this. When you take your struts/shocks off, and if you disassemble them, you will see that they are quite worn, based on the time each takes to return from compression to a full extension.

The DIY spring compression tools are safe if used properly. There are a lot of YT videos of people using it; many are using the tool incorrectly w/ an impact wrench to save time.
*The strut/shock should be mounted in a bench vise grip.
*Wear eye protection.
*Position the tool on opposite ends.
*Use a hand ratchet and apply equal amount of turns to the nut on the compression tool, on each side equally, in an alternating fashion. IE, half turn on side 1, go to other side and apply a half turns on side 2. Repeat this process unltill spring compresses enough to remove strut/shock. One side may need more turns than the other; this would be normal b/c its a spring and the sides are not equal in length. The tool may move, a little from being exactly 180degree apart. This would be normal. If the tool moves a lot, you should uncompress and reposition. You can try applying locking pliers to the spring and the thick black metal part of the tool, or on each side of the black metal part, so the tool doesn't move.

You can always take the old strut/shock assembly to a auto shop and they can dissasemble the old worn assembly and reassemble w/ the new parts (if you do the individual components) for a small fee. Pricing now my be $40/assembly.

STOP asking what the warranty details of KYB/Monroe are. You need to read the black/white text of the two companies strut/shock warranty policy yourself, or contact the company. Someone could be mistaken/lying, or the policy could have recently changed for the better or worse. Different countries will have different policies. Time for you to do some easy DIY and read the details of what is and is NOT covered under warranty.
Click to expand...

Thank you very much for all your great explanations. Of course I would study the 2 different systems and their warranties in detail before buying anything. YES, you are right. I tend to overthink everything. I'm very conservative and perfectionist.

If you thought I was asking about the unlimited warranty for the Monroe because I'm doubting your word on this please STOP. I'm not. I'm just curious to see how this policy behaves around the world
 
#14 ·
vmmf said:
I almost never go off road. Highway most of the time.
Click to expand...
slow and steady off roading probably wont wear the shocks that much at all. It's rutted or corse gravel roads at speed that really moves the up and down so much that the pistion travel measued in inches would be equivalent to perhaps thousands of miles on a smooth highway.
vmmf said:
Have you been able to replace your worn out Monroes on warranty?
Click to expand...
never count on the warranty for parts that take a lot of work to install. Allways buy the product you believe will last the longest. Sure you can gamble on light bulbs and easy to replace items but not integral parts. I replaced the monroes with standard Pro-Comp which had larger diameter pistions, those never wore out.
vmmf said:
Do you know if KYB is Toyota OEM?
Click to expand...
Many Toyotas have Tokico, perhaps most.
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
About this Discussion
13 Replies
3 Participants
Last post:
Jack Daniels
Toyota RAV4 Forums
posts
1.1M
members
174K
Since
2004
Rav 4 World is the internet's largest Toyota Rav4 SUV and EV online forum community. Discuss towing, modifications, and more.
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
4.3 General 4.3 Mechanical 4.5 RAV4 Hybrid (except Prime) 4.5 RAV4 Prime 4.3 Exterior