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Heating Rav4 Prime in cold <-10C weather

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cold temperatures heating interior prime rav4
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#21 ·
NoelinColorado said:
. Doesn't warm coolant also contribute to incoming HVAC air, or is it either/or heat pump, or hot coolant?
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Good question. According to the below video (go to around 8:50 for the schematic diagram of the HVAC system) by a Toyota hybrid mechanic, it is an either/or scenario. The 3 way valve near the heater core decides whether to use engine heat or to use refrigerant heat.

 
#22 ·
borealcat said:
Thanks! We were offered the block heater for the Prime and had that installed at time of purchase. The dealer is getting back to me about the Comfort+ system.
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let me save you some time. The system is made by DEFA and is sold in Canada under the Comfort + banner for toyota and through authorized service stations. The cabin heater and blue tooth remote haven't been tested in the Prime as of yet, so Toyota won't install one for you. I already have the DEFA block heater installed by the dealer. I contacted one of DEFA's authorized dealers and they would install the cabin heater and blue tooth remote for about $1100. Too steep for me for a little more comfort.

I don't mind driving around at -20C with the heated seats and a jacket, but the windows will start to fog without any fans. It would be a nice option to have access to some light fan without the need for the engine to come on.
 
#23 ·
Where are you? I'm in Sask. I've had my Prime since February. Yep the gas engine runs a lot to provide cabin heat below -10C. I came from a Tesla where the gas engine would never kick in when cold LOL so it takes some getting used to.

Typical cabin heat for EVs is a big draw on the battery and Toyota puts efficiency above user convenience, so yeah that's why you need to run the gas.

What I personally do is manually toggle the HVAC "Auto" and "Off". I leave it on Auto while driving but turn it off if I'm in a drive-thru or stopped at a red light, etc. So I do still get to turn off the gas engine manually when I can. I also sometimes leave it off after the red light for a block or a few blocks if the windows are clear.

Ultimately the vehicle is a phenomenal all-around vehicle, not perfect, but all vehicles have their pros & cons.
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
2wheeler said:
let me save you some time. The system is made by DEFA and is sold in Canada under the Comfort + banner for toyota and through authorized service stations. The cabin heater and blue tooth remote haven't been tested in the Prime as of yet, so Toyota won't install one for you. I already have the DEFA block heater installed by the dealer. I contacted one of DEFA's authorized dealers and they would install the cabin heater and blue tooth remote for about $1100. Too steep for me for a little more comfort.

I don't mind driving around at -20C with the heated seats and a jacket, but the windows will start to fog without any fans. It would be a nice option to have access to some light fan without the need for the engine to come on.
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Thanks folks! Great to learn of other northern experiences. We are in the Yukon (-34C today 😊 ) Thanks 2wheeler for that heads up, that Comfort+ NOT available for R4 Prime, which my dealer also confirmed today. They recommended a standard plug in car space heater from Canadian Tire. Hopefully Toyota will test the DEFA system on Prime, which could allow adding to the existing DEFA block heater system (hopefully that would be cheaper than the DEFA dealer install you mentioned!). Indeed, it is a small increase in comfort for the price, since it is only effective when vehicle is parked and plugged in.

I so agree, access to a light fan could solve the issue of ICE engagement when driving in cold temps. I've looked at small, low wattage fans that can be supported by the interior 10A power supply, I might try one to see if it can defrost the window, as well as take the bite off the interior cold air, versus starting vehicle fans and ICE. But my suspicion is that the heat generated (120W max) will be too low.

We drove the Prime in auto mode, which engaged the ICE whenever cabin heat and defrost was needed (-25C). Very comfy, however efficiency dropped to 7.4 l/100 km. Switched to EV on trip home without fans/defrost, and efficiency improved to 1.7 l/100km... but cold :sneaky:. Quite a hit in fuel efficiency/carbon reduction for heat and defrost. I am so curious what the hit in range would be if that was supplied instead by the battery.

Thank you 21Prime, I will try the strategic toggling. Agreed, a terrific vehicle. It is perfect for us, where we have the flexibility to drive to remote areas where there are no communities/plug ins for 100's of km, but lets us do our local community and rural travel 100% electric.
 
#25 ·
borealcat said:
Thanks folks! Great to learn of other northern experiences. We are in the Yukon (-34C today 😊 ) Thanks 2wheeler for that heads up, that Comfort+ NOT available for R4 Prime, which my dealer also confirmed today. They recommended a standard plug in car space heater from Canadian Tire. Hopefully Toyota will test the DEFA system on Prime, which could allow adding to the existing DEFA block heater system (hopefully that would be cheaper than the DEFA dealer install you mentioned!). Indeed, it is a small increase in comfort for the price, since it is only effective when vehicle is parked and plugged in.

I so agree, access to a light fan could solve the issue of ICE engagement when driving in cold temps. I've looked at small, low wattage fans that can be supported by the interior 10A power supply, I might try one to see if it can defrost the window, as well as take the bite off the interior cold air, versus starting vehicle fans and ICE. But my suspicion is that the heat generated (120W max) will be too low.

We drove the Prime in auto mode, which engaged the ICE whenever cabin heat and defrost was needed (-25C). Very comfy, however efficiency dropped to 7.4 l/100 km. Switched to EV on trip home without fans/defrost, and efficiency improved to 1.7 l/100km... but cold :sneaky:. Quite a hit in fuel efficiency/carbon reduction for heat and defrost. I am so curious what the hit in range would be if that was supplied instead by the battery.

Thank you 21Prime, I will try the strategic toggling. Agreed, a terrific vehicle. It is perfect for us, where we have the flexibility to drive to remote areas where there are no communities/plug ins for 100's of km, but lets us do our local community and rural travel 100% electric.
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I'm up in Whitehorse frequently, and as I've seen one Prime in Town it was probably you!

I wonder if a portable battery powered fan would do the trick for the windshield?
 
Discussion starter · #26 ·
2wheeler said:
I'm up in Whitehorse frequently, and as I've seen one Prime in Town it was probably you!

I wonder if a portable battery powered fan would do the trick for the windshield?
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2wheeler said:
I'm up in Whitehorse frequently, and as I've seen one Prime in Town it was probably you!

I wonder if a portable battery powered fan would do the trick for the windshield?
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We were #7, arrived this August after a year... high demand! I will be trying a small fan/heater in the new year, and will report results back here.
 
#30 · (Edited)
borealcat said:
Also looking into a 12V 10 amp space heater powered by vehicle 12V 10A power supply, to use while driving.
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We use a 1000w heater in our master bathroom upstairs and it's insufficient to heat the room for taking a shower in during the winter, and while it's been down to -20C this winter that room only gets down to 58F or so, so is nowhere near the cold temps you're talking about for your cabin temp. We added a 1500W heater which is good enough though still takes several minutes to heat up, now with 2,500 watts between both heaters. If you have the 1500W A/C outlet I think the Premium Package has perhaps that's where to tap into to get power for a much larger heater than the 120W heater you're thinking of, which really does look to be totally useless in this role.
 
#31 ·
#32 ·
borealcat said:
But the window fogs up, so need to turn on fan... which engages ICE
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FWIW, and that may not be much because we are in a dry cold environment in winter, so the windows hardly ever fog up and this is all the say down to . That being said we very frequently use the fan only in EV mode and this does not engage the ICE. However, when we do this we only will do it when outside temp is lower than cabin temp, in order to cool the car down, and maybe the reverse could be true in summertime. It can be 1 degree Celsius and so sunny, clear and bright out that the car gets too warm so we run the fan AND set the temperature to the lowest setting to cool the car down.
 
#33 ·
NameofUser said:
You inquire about a Prime, but post in the Hybrid section (2019+ model year). What vehicle are you truly talking about? If you indeed have a Prime, click on any posting w/in your thread, and "REPORT" to request your post be moved to the RAV4 Prime.
View attachment 174997


If you picked up a NEW car, did anyone NOT tell you about the COMFORT+ accessory?
Did you NOT browse the accessories: online or at the dealership?
www.toyota.ca

Toyota Genuine Accessories | Toyota Canada

Find the latest Toyota accessories and TRD parts for your car, truck or SUV online right here. Learn more about genuine auto Accessories from Toyota Canada.
www.toyota.ca www.toyota.ca
View attachment 174996

If you truly have a R4P (RAV4 Prime), you failed to research your vehicle purchase.
Vehicles that use a Heat Pump for the HVAC system do NOT perform well in VERY COLD environments!
You are finding this out after the fact. Poor heat performance from vehicles with Heat Pump HVAC systems is the downside of Heat Pumps, but they are very efficient and help increase EV range for EV/PHEV vehicles. But, Heat Pumps are not able to really heat up the car in VERY cold environments. A vehicle heat pump HVAC needs a supplement heat source like a tradition coolant based heater core, for the VERY cold environment. This would be impossible for an EV, but possible for a PHEV. However, gas mileage would decrease a lot if the heater relied on HOT engine coolant. Obviously manufactures sacrified warmth for greater EV range by going w/ a Heat Pump.

If you really want hot heat, you'll have to change vehicles to one w/ a coolant based heater core, or move w/ your R4P to an area that is less cold, so the Heat Pump can actually provide you some heat.
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Thanks for your so nicely written answer. Nice tone. To your missbelief, I do have a Prime (few days ago) and did the reaserch. Sorry if it was not enough to your taste. I taught there was a benefit for some starting this post. I am also sorry for making you loose valuable time. Wait, there may be a tax here for stupid and noobs which are not as noledgable others or for those that havn't found the correct answer on the older posts right away. Or there is a tax on asking question to perfect one's knowledge. If so, feel free to report me to the grand chief or what-ever police department there is. I will gladly pay the fine or obige to whatever rule I was not aware of. Meanwhile, please note I'm on the correct post (at least on my computer - see below image) and have a verry nice evening.

Image
 
#35 ·
The last few winters I put a residential style electric heater in my Prius every night when parking it. Activated by a cheap outlet remote control from my house 80' away. I turned it on about 1 hour before leaving, at the 750 watts setting. I may do it this year with the Prime, as so far the remote keyfob turning on of the heater seems to be ineffective, but I've only tried it twice so it could be used error!
 
#37 ·
anav_ds said:
How did you power the electric heater............. Or are you saying you cracked a window and ran an electrical cord inside..........
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I used a flat (rather than round) short good quality extension cord, and held it flat while closing the right rear door, with just the cord socket outside. Not enough to flap in the breeze or for anyone to notice really, if they did, I just told them it was a plug in car! Trusting the door seal to conform itself..., crude but it worked fine. I also went a bit out of my way to not use that door if I could help it, to not have to make the door seal re-conform to a new location. I have power in the pole barn, free/renewable no less, more than I need, so why get into a cold car?
 
#38 ·
ptom said:
I used a flat (rather than round) short good quality extension cord, and held it flat while closing the right rear door, with just the cord socket outside. Not enough to flap in the breeze or for anyone to notice really, if they did, I just told them it was a plug in car! Trusting the door seal to conform itself..., crude but it worked fine. I also went a bit out of my way to not use that door if I could help it, to not have to make the door seal re-conform to a new location. I have power in the pole barn, free/renewable no less, more than I need, so why get into a cold car?
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As clever as that is it sounds like an accident waiting to happen. Why not have a proper interior socket installed and use an approved car interior heater? The expense should be small compared to accidentally burning down your car and possibly your house too in one go.

Image


Now what I'd really like to see is that kind of interior socket somehow spliced from the charging port so you don't need two cables. :unsure:
 
#39 ·
#40 ·
Doing it myself is well within my skill set, without burning down my house or car! My crane cab has a Espar diesel heater that is fantastically efficient, uses outside combustion air, is quiet, and safe. I may burn 5 gallons of diesel all winter, running for several hours a day, no diesel smell, before anyone asks. Overkill really, just throwing that option out there for LOTS of instant heat. My light plane has poor heating, I too have found light gloves, a good down jacket, and a lap blanket make a world of difference, also simpler and less weight than other options.
 
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