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2021 RAV4 XLE Premium Hybrid
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You know, I have to get my head wrapped around this car and how it runs. You are absolutely correct in that if the odometer shows 1000 miles, those are not 1000 ICE miles on your ICE engine. I would say now that it IS <50% and probably more. The car doesn't record the miles the ICE engine ran I suppose? (Dumb question because I am pretty sure I know the answer and that is the car doesn't split it for mileage for EV and mileage for ICE). 馃ゴ
You are correct.
 

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2021 XSE Hybrid, Blizzard Pearl
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66 Posts
they just want to do the service when its not time yet cause they get paid for it, for a hybrid all they really do is rotate the tire and look for leaks anything shinny when they shine their flash lights at it, no magic show. they don't even want to top off the fluids they just look at it and go its good even tho you asked them to top it off. its not like the old days were u get the nice full service, never again dealer service.
 

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2022 RAV4 Prime SE in Midnight Black Metallic
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135 Posts
they just want to do the service when its not time yet cause they get paid for it, for a hybrid all they really do is rotate the tire and look for leaks anything shinny when they shine their flash lights at it, no magic show. they don't even want to top off the fluids they just look at it and go its good even tho you asked them to top it off. its not like the old days were u get the nice full service, never again dealer service.
I don't know about your Toyota dealer but my Acura dealer (Joe Rizza Acura) always tops off everything and washes & vacuums the car before returning it. I know they check things because they will come back with the air filter for the engine or the cabin air filter or show me or the transmission fluid on the dip stick or rear transfer case fluid, etc. It's up to me whether I let them change those things (some times I do and some times I don't). They run a sort of stress test on my battery and check the seals and boots (one time they found a ripped boot and showed it to me) and other things on the check list. They measure the tread depth of the tires and the thickness of the brake shoe linings/condition of the rotors. When I had my Lexus (Lexus of Orland Park - RX 300) and the other 3 Toyotas (Orland Toyota - 2 Prius's and a Corolla) it was the same thing. Also with my Fords (Currie Motors of Frankfort - many many Fords over the years the last one being a Fusion Hybrid).

I guess all dealers are not the same and I'm sorry to hear that you feel your dealer is shorting you. I don't think I'd go back either if I thought they weren't doing what they are supposed to.
 

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21 RAV4 XLE Premium AWD Gas
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160 Posts
Our Dealer would not change the oil accept at 10,000 miles, i should have paid for it at the 5000 mile check up, which they called and insisted that it was time to do it, so we waited 4 hours and they bitched under their breath that it was absurd that they were so busy and i brought it in for a tire rotation, so i guess i waited for hours for a tire rotation and a bitching out.

Now at the second 10,000 mile oil change they said the pan may be leaking, but didnt bother pointing it out to me, so when i read about it i asked them, so they cleaned it off the last time and indeed the pan gasket was leaking, but i had to ask them about checking it again. So the 3 month old Oil got dumped, pan gasket changed, new oil added, they said 5 quarts, it doesnt hold 5 qts. i found out today, they did not change the filter since they just did it 2 or 3 thousand miles ago. So now i get to Change the Oil filter, not sure how much oil will be lost doing that.

Last month i was told if i wanted a free alignment i needed to ask for one before ? So many miles, well its got 19,000 now so no free one, however at the last oil change they said the alignment was out and it was gonna be 99.00, i said no. front is out 1 degree on both sides, on the bottom reading, i dont have it in my hand, car tracks well and does not pull, also see no wear on the tires, i will take it to Tires + for a lifetime alignment for 179.00...
 

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Our Dealer would not change the oil accept at 10,000 miles, i should have paid for it at the 5000 mile check up, which they called and insisted that it was time to do it, so we waited 4 hours and they bitched under their breath that it was absurd that they were so busy and i brought it in for a tire rotation, so i guess i waited for hours for a tire rotation and a bitching out.

Now at the second 10,000 mile oil change they said the pan may be leaking, but didnt bother pointing it out to me, so when i read about it i asked them, so they cleaned it off the last time and indeed the pan gasket was leaking, but i had to ask them about checking it again. So the 3 month old Oil got dumped, pan gasket changed, new oil added, they said 5 quarts, it doesnt hold 5 qts. i found out today, they did not change the filter since they just did it 2 or 3 thousand miles ago. So now i get to Change the Oil filter, not sure how much oil will be lost doing that.

Last month i was told if i wanted a free alignment i needed to ask for one before ? So many miles, well its got 19,000 now so no free one, however at the last oil change they said the alignment was out and it was gonna be 99.00, i said no. front is out 1 degree on both sides, on the bottom reading, i dont have it in my hand, car tracks well and does not pull, also see no wear on the tires, i will take it to Tires + for a lifetime alignment for 179.00...
I am a retired master technician and have my own schedule for oil and filter changes that I follow and won鈥檛 let anyone tell me otherwise. The first 500 - 1000 miles makes the most difference and I drive the vehicle very consistently within specific RPM and speed ranges. I always change the oil and filter at the 500 and 1000 mile marks. The reason is simple, that is when the engine will have the highest volume of metallic particulate related to the friction surfaces and rotating components. The proof is always in the oil, the oil pan and most importantly the oil filter. Then I will go to the manufacturers recommend schedule, when it鈥檚 reasonable and doesn鈥檛 just promote premature engine wear and early failure.
That being said the RAV4 Prime and all hybrids have the ability to get around under electric power for miles that don鈥檛 require the ICE to run. Being that Toyota in their desire to keep your services at their dealerships and make their fair share of profits from specific services and repairs. Their engineering departments decide when services will be done based on type of lubricants, tolerances of rotating friction surfaces and metallurgical make up of the components. Considering all of these things I still do my oil changes on my schedule and pay out of my pocket to get it done my way. The dealerships have no problem doing so because they are making money doing so.
 

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21 RAV4 XLE Premium AWD Gas
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160 Posts
Yea i am a Retired Man, been around engines all my life, i shoulda listen to my old self, and changed the oil, even if they dont say it, it is frowned upon to work on your own car under warranty.
Had i known they were not going to change the filter, i would have insisted upon it, even if they charged me, Cheap ins.
 

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Our Dealer would not change the oil accept at 10,000 miles, i should have paid for it at the 5000 mile check up, which they called and insisted that it was time to do it, so we waited 4 hours and they bitched under their breath that it was absurd that they were so busy and i brought it in for a tire rotation, so i guess i waited for hours for a tire rotation and a bitching out.

Now at the second 10,000 mile oil change they said the pan may be leaking, but didnt bother pointing it out to me, so when i read about it i asked them, so they cleaned it off the last time and indeed the pan gasket was leaking, but i had to ask them about checking it again. So the 3 month old Oil got dumped, pan gasket changed, new oil added, they said 5 quarts, it doesnt hold 5 qts. i found out today, they did not change the filter since they just did it 2 or 3 thousand miles ago. So now i get to Change the Oil filter, not sure how much oil will be lost doing that.

Last month i was told if i wanted a free alignment i needed to ask for one before ? So many miles, well its got 19,000 now so no free one, however at the last oil change they said the alignment was out and it was gonna be 99.00, i said no. front is out 1 degree on both sides, on the bottom reading, i dont have it in my hand, car tracks well and does not pull, also see no wear on the tires, i will take it to Tires + for a lifetime alignment for 179.00...
I have a 21 R4P and at 5k it was not much more than a tire rotation. I took the vehicle back at 1 year checkup and it only had about 7500 miles and only about 1500 used ICE. My dealer changed the oil at 1 year even though I was nowhere near 10k and said it is not just the milage but age of oil too. With the 25k/2 year free maintance I'll only get two oil changes and then next one will be at the 2 year interval and at current driving pace the vehicle will be at about 15k. I suggest you look for another dealer.
 

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2022 RAV4 Prime SE in Midnight Black Metallic
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I am a retired master technician and have my own schedule for oil and filter changes that I follow and won鈥檛 let anyone tell me otherwise. The first 500 - 1000 miles makes the most difference and I drive the vehicle very consistently within specific RPM and speed ranges. I always change the oil and filter at the 500 and 1000 mile marks. The reason is simple, that is when the engine will have the highest volume of metallic particulate related to the friction surfaces and rotating components. The proof is always in the oil, the oil pan and most importantly the oil filter. Then I will go to the manufacturers recommend schedule, when it鈥檚 reasonable and doesn鈥檛 just promote premature engine wear and early failure.
That being said the RAV4 Prime and all hybrids have the ability to get around under electric power for miles that don鈥檛 require the ICE to run. Being that Toyota in their desire to keep your services at their dealerships and make their fair share of profits from specific services and repairs. Their engineering departments decide when services will be done based on type of lubricants, tolerances of rotating friction surfaces and metallurgical make up of the components. Considering all of these things I still do my oil changes on my schedule and pay out of my pocket to get it done my way. The dealerships have no problem doing so because they are making money doing so.
Sounds reasonable and the Car Nut concurs with you. But with this plug-in hybrid how do you know how many ICE miles vs. electric miles? If you go strictly by the odometer you might be changing the oil way before the ICE engine records 500 miles on it鈥檚 own. I suppose if you did both 500 & 1000 miles you would be reasonable sure there were at least 500 miles on ICE engine itself. I guess you could press the trip monitor every time it鈥檚 in HV mode and add them all up to come up with a more accurate mileage on the ICE engine.
 

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I don't think anybody should expect a free front end alignment at 19,000 miles. For me that would be saying "Hey dealership, I've treated the car horribly for the last three years and for some reason my alignment feels odd, that's free right?"

A vehicle not aligned properly during assembly would be evident way earlier and should be corrected at no cost, but not even at 5,000 miles.
If I want to give Toyota a bit of credit, they 'inspect' at 5,000 and during rotation should let the customer know the tires are wearing prematurely and that they will cover the alignment -considering they think the owner cant make their own decisions, how are we supposed to know the tires are scrubbing. ha Yeah, you won't let me get oil change at 5k but I'm supposed to know my tires have worn in an odd pattern.
 

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I am a retired master technician and have my own schedule for oil and filter changes that I follow and won鈥檛 let anyone tell me otherwise. The first 500 - 1000 miles makes the most difference and I drive the vehicle very consistently within specific RPM and speed ranges. I always change the oil and filter at the 500 and 1000 mile marks. The reason is simple, that is when the engine will have the highest volume of metallic particulate related to the friction surfaces and rotating components. The proof is always in the oil, the oil pan and most importantly the oil filter. Then I will go to the manufacturers recommend schedule, when it鈥檚 reasonable and doesn鈥檛 just promote premature engine wear and early failure.
That being said the RAV4 Prime and all hybrids have the ability to get around under electric power for miles that don鈥檛 require the ICE to run. Being that Toyota in their desire to keep your services at their dealerships and make their fair share of profits from specific services and repairs. Their engineering departments decide when services will be done based on type of lubricants, tolerances of rotating friction surfaces and metallurgical make up of the components. Considering all of these things I still do my oil changes on my schedule and pay out of my pocket to get it done my way. The dealerships have no problem doing so because they are making money doing so.
I agree! A Toyota Master Diagnostic Mechanic recommended that same thing to me. I changed my oil at 600 after following the recommended break-in. I intend to change it again at 5K but after listening to you I might get it change now at 2700. and 5K after that. The 10K is mostly a marketing number! IF you read the Maintenance Recommendations you'll find most cars don't fall into the 10K recommendation but actually the 5K recommendation due to the way they are driven.
The main point here is this: Changing the oil and filter is the cheapest thing that you can do to keep your toyota running into the 200-300K miles.
 

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Sounds reasonable and the Car Nut concurs with you. But with this plug-in hybrid how do you know how many ICE miles vs. electric miles? If you go strictly by the odometer you might be changing the oil way before the ICE engine records 500 miles on it鈥檚 own. I suppose if you did both 500 & 1000 miles you would be reasonable sure there were at least 500 miles on ICE engine itself. I guess you could press the trip monitor every time it鈥檚 in HV mode and add them all up to come up with a more accurate mileage on the ICE engine.
There was another discussion on the topic of ICE vs EV miles. The onboard computer certainly knows how many miles in each mode but for unknown reasons Toyota chose not to display such info. It was also brought out in the same discussion that you had such info on the Chevy Volt years ago. It is disappointing that Toyota does not provide such info.
 

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2021 XSE Hybrid, Blizzard Pearl
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changed mine at 1000 miles and going for another at 5k but not at the dealer that's for sure. done this for every single car i had. for the manual ones i even changed the trans and diff fluids too. after hearing PDXMOJO i feel like i should adjust my oil change timing for break in starting at 500miles for the first one and 1000 at the second one.
 

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2022 RAV4 Prime SE in Midnight Black Metallic
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135 Posts
There was another discussion on the topic of ICE vs EV miles. The onboard computer certainly knows how many miles in each mode but for unknown reasons Toyota chose not to display such info. It was also brought out in the same discussion that you had such info on the Chevy Volt years ago. It is disappointing that Toyota does not provide such info.
Yes, I've decided to keep a log on when I use the HV by pressing Trip A and keeping track of it that way. I have 75 miles so far on HV but things will add up quickly with going to my daughter's house 150 miles round trip and visiting my brother 60 miles round trip and volunteering 72 miles round trip in the next week alone (357 miles by the end of next week on HV). I'll hit 500 miles on HV sometime in October.
 

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Yes, I've decided to keep a log on when I use the HV by pressing Trip A and keeping track of it that way. I have 75 miles so far on HV but things will add up quickly with going to my daughter's house 150 miles round trip and visiting my brother 60 miles round trip and volunteering 72 miles round trip in the next week alone (357 miles by the end of next week on HV). I'll hit 500 miles on HV sometime in October.
Another option is to keep track of how many KwH used. In my case, my charger app shows me daily usage and monthly totals. My EV driving is typically in the same range per KwH so I can get a fairly accurate total miles each month. This is way easier than using the trip meter.
 

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21 RAV4 XLE Premium AWD Gas
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I don't think anybody should expect a free front end alignment at 19,000 miles. For me that would be saying "Hey dealership, I've treated the car horribly for the last three years and for some reason my alignment feels odd, that's free right?"

A vehicle not aligned properly during assembly would be evident way earlier and should be corrected at no cost, but not even at 5,000 miles.
If I want to give Toyota a bit of credit, they 'inspect' at 5,000 and during rotation should let the customer know the tires are wearing prematurely and that they will cover the alignment -considering they think the owner cant make their own decisions, how are we supposed to know the tires are scrubbing. ha Yeah, you won't let me get oil change at 5k but I'm supposed to know my tires have worn in an odd pattern.
Not quiete what i was trying to get across, Only after mentioning that no one told me that we could have gotten an-alignment on the car for free, but we had to mention it, back when the miles were low, i said what about an inspection, they told me they did an inspection, i said its not on the list of things checked, then was told that any paperwork on it would have cycled out of the computer, i said why now that i mention the alignment i get a paper showing its out of alignment and its to be 100.00..? Never had we received a paper showing the spec's as you would after being put on an alignment rack. Until Now when i mentioned it, suddenly its out of spec.

I mean the guy as good as griped us out for bringing in the car for a Tire Rotation when they were so busy, something that their staff called and set up, So by his own mouth the 5000 mile check was just a tire rotation that we waited 4 hours or so on.
 

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Sounds reasonable and the Car Nut concurs with you. But with this plug-in hybrid how do you know how many ICE miles vs. electric miles? If you go strictly by the odometer you might be changing the oil way before the ICE engine records 500 miles on it鈥檚 own. I suppose if you did both 500 & 1000 miles you would be reasonable sure there were at least 500 miles on ICE engine itself. I guess you could press the trip monitor every time it鈥檚 in HV mode and add them all up to come up with a more accurate mileage on the ICE engine.
I appreciate that you have questions to how we can gauge the miles. There are a few ways and yes one would be to keep track of the HV miles, as well as track the miles of trips beyond the 40 - 45 miles and the total of each trip. Last but not necessarily least is to use the WAG system, as in Wild Ass Guess. I use them all, but mostly just the first two.
 

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I agree! A Toyota Master Diagnostic Mechanic recommended that same thing to me. I changed my oil at 600 after following the recommended break-in. I intend to change it again at 5K but after listening to you I might get it change now at 2700. and 5K after that. The 10K is mostly a marketing number! IF you read the Maintenance Recommendations you'll find most cars don't fall into the 10K recommendation but actually the 5K recommendation due to the way they are driven.
The main point here is this: Changing the oil and filter is the cheapest thing that you can do to keep your toyota running into the 200-300K miles.
You are absolutely correct!
 
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