Toyota RAV4 Forums banner

4661 - 4680 of 5013 Posts

·
Registered
🇨🇦 2020 RAV4 XLE Hybrid - Super White
Joined
·
434 Posts
I wonder if there's any correlation to factory of origin, I know I know, I won't add to the conspiracy and will leave it at that. I have 20 fill-up's with no indication of the problem with mine.

I called TC recently to inquire if I was affected by the control arm recall, and learned where my car was made, the rep indicated my '20 XLEh was born in the Woodstock, Ontario TMMC (there's 3 plants in Ontario).
 

·
Registered
🇨🇦 2020 RAV4 XLE Hybrid - Super White
Joined
·
434 Posts
My issue is not as severe as several on this forum. If I use any click at a pump...it shuts off after a couple gallons and there is no way I can get to full in any manner. If I use the barely moving flow I can get a full tank most of the time. Every once in a while it would click off before I got to the Full mark. I have not had it overflow on me. Kinda sucked in winter but we get the expected MPG so it wasn't to horrible.

Since mine is a J build in the July time frame that tosses out the USA only built machines.
Glad there's movement though based on that doc to get you back to where you should be, sooooon...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
612 Posts
Thanks for posting!

One thing I found important is Q6. I think this was very important for people to know about: just because the tank holds 14.5 gallons, you should not expect to fill that much at the pump in normal conditions.

But something important is missing here. They never said how much fuel you should normally expect to fill! The owner's manual says roughly how much fuel is in the tank when the low fuel light comes on, but this is the first confirmation I've seen that the "auto-stop level" and the top of the tank are different amounts. And we're never told how much that is.

I'm reminded of the somewhat recent YouTube video comparing the RAV4 and CR-V hybrids in fuel economy. Their standard procedure is to fill up, wait 30 seconds, and then do a single top-off, the with goal of ensuring consistency. They noted off-hand just how much more fuel the RAV4 on this top-off than the CR-V. And that's been my experience as well, usually getting another half gallon or more in there.

This isn't common with other vehicles. At least, I've never noticed it before. And I suspect it's been part of the problem people have been experiencing. This seems to be by design, and so will not go away with any fix. It's best to understand it right now so there's no surprises. And if anybody wants to dig through the last 4600 posts here, we've confirmed that the SAE standard allows this behavior.

So here's what to expect. If you fill up like you do any other car when the low fuel light comes on and don't top-off, you should get about 11.5 gallons of gas in the tank. If you average 40 MPG, expect the DTE to be somewhere around 460 miles. You can add maybe another 20-30 miles if you top off the tank once or twice.
But it’s still wrong. Toyota has from the very beginning advertised a range of approx. 600 miles. If now all
Of a sudden they are saying that will never happen, that’s not ok.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
677 Posts
But it’s still wrong. Toyota has from the very beginning advertised a range of approx. 600 miles. If now all
Of a sudden they are saying that will never happen, that’s not ok.
I do think it's a bit disingenuous to claim a 14.5 gallon tank, which they can do by the SAE standard for how these things are measured, but then only allow ~14 gallons if you follow the procedure in the owner's manual. So you go from discussions from executives about 600 miles (probably rounding up from the actual number), to an actual advertised range of 580 miles (tank size times rated fuel economy), to the actual range of 560 miles (if filled according to the owner's manual), to a real-world range of 500 miles if you only do what the DTE tells you and not use the reserve.

That's frustrating, to seemingly lose 100 miles of range. Some of it is just how cars work -- nobody drives until their tank is dry -- but most of it is Toyota's own fault. Rounding up the range in discussions (inflating expectations), having an auto-stop level that's significantly lower than full (an actual reduction in range), and not including the reserve in the Distance to Empty (lowering the perceived range).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,854 Posts
I don't doubt that the vehicle doesn't live up to MPG claims (we are close enough). However I don't expect "MPG" on the EPA sticker to be steadfast in stone.

Whats going to happen is if people do get a proper fill (lets call it 13.5 gallons) and don't see anywhere near 600. Then Toyota is going to get an earful. There are people on here that expect that no matter what you get 44 in the city and 40 or whatever on the highway. As long as I still get above 40 in the city and 38/39, which is what I get in non-winter weather, on the highway Ill be good.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
91 Posts
Friends - I hope all of you can see what I uploaded. It was a bit of a chore one at a time. As mentioned this is the document I was given Friday when I picked up my 2019 XSE after my 15k checkin
Yes, I spent the first 15 mins talking to the service advisor on all negative aspects for not being able to fill up my gas tank but on the bright side you get to do that more frequently as well. Hoping we get a fix soon now. I see this as positive
I got the letter in the mail today. They are providing coverage to repair for 8 years or 100k miles from date of purchase.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
472 Posts
The question that comes to my mind is whether this means that as of April 2020 builds the problem has been solved, or does it say April 2020 merely because that's when production shut down due to COVID? Is this just a fancy way of saying they're aware of the problem, because there is STILL no indication that they know what the solution is. So I question whether there is any reason to believe that current builds will finally be free of the issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
317 Posts
I am believing that with the documentation of how Toyota is now indicating the actual fill range of the tank and especially the top portion that can't be filled would represent a possible fraudulent claim by Toyota to a range of 600 miles. They always claimed with the reserve you actually had 14.5 gallons so you could get 600 miles. But now that they are saying the top portion of the tank is not usable then there is possible no way to get a 600 mile range. That sounds like possible false advertising.. Have to see how the gallons work out. Maybe if you get the fix you give up any further recourse for damages. Be interested if there is a waiver involved.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts
The quote about 600 mile per tank range was just a high level Toyota person talking, and the numbers are not binding or enforceable. Just disappointing when you can't reach that range. But there are SAE procedures to determine gas tank capacity and they are;
Interesting. To get the rated (advertised) capacity, They insert the nozzle completely, set the latch for max flow rate, and allow to fill to first click. After 5 seconds, set latch to minimum flow rate and allow to shut off automatically. Then repeat that last step. The amount of fuel is then Recorded and the whole process is repeated until they get an average fuel capacity with a 90% confidence level (statistical stuff).
That amount is the tank capacity.
So if a owner can not get the SAE specified gas tank capacity Toyota should be responsible to make it right.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
50 Posts
Just got a letter from Toyota today that they are acknowledging the problem and a fix is in process to replace the fuel tank and fuel sender gauge unit. They are working on the repair procedures and materials to complete the repair for affected vehicles. This may take several months and letters will be sent to affected owners when they can get the fix.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Just got a letter from Toyota today that they are acknowledging the problem and a fix is in process to replace the fuel tank and fuel sender gauge unit. They are working on the repair procedures and materials to complete the repair for affected vehicles. This may take several months and letters will be sent to affected owners when they can get the fix.
Have you callled Toyota or documented the issue with dealer before? I have the issue on my 2019 HAV4H, but haven't received any notice.
 

·
Registered
2020 Rav4 Limited
Joined
·
48 Posts
You complain or document anything, or did they just send it over with no prior interaction?
I got the letter today as well without a complaint from me or having my car documented for repair. I haven't even brought the car in for it's first 5000 mile service yet. My car is the 2020 Limited Hybrid.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
612 Posts
The quote about 600 mile per tank range was just a high level Toyota person talking, and the numbers are not binding or enforceable. Just disappointing when you can't reach that range. But there are SAE procedures to determine gas tank capacity and they are;


So if a owner can not get the SAE specified gas tank capacity Toyota should be responsible to make it right.
It was literally the lead engineer on the project. You know, the one who designed the vehicle?
Also, dealerships are advertising a 580 mi range.

but yeah, I agree with you (and I’m the one that posted that ;)) it sort of feels like a dishonest sales tactic to say the least.
 
4661 - 4680 of 5013 Posts
Top