[ToyoptimusPrime]

Hello everybody, long time lurker and first time thread maker here, hoping to find a resolution to my issue (if it is).

While installing a Front Runner Slimline II roof rack the other day I was tightening one of the bolts and felt the gut-wrenching yield when it stops getting tight and just spins. The bolt in question is circled in the picture below. I ended up using a steel epoxy to coat the threads on the bolt and tightening it down as much as it would go. I waited a day and then finished the installation of the rack.

The bolt was still not as tight as the other ones so my major concern is that I've now created an intrusion point for water to leak into the vehicle. Is that the case or does this bolt hole only open up to the waterproof canal that runs underneath the raised plastic rail?

As for the structural integrity issues this may cause for the rack itself, the loose bolt is only 1 out of 8 bolts that hold the feet so once the rack was on it felt very secure and did not wobble or move by the stripped bolt. So hopefully this is not an issue.

Anyway, thank you for any information that can be provided.

 

[FKHeath]

Hello everybody, long time lurker and first time thread maker here, hoping to find a resolution to my issue (if it is).

While installing a Front Runner Slimline II roof rack the other day I was tightening one of the bolts and felt the gut-wrenching yield when it stops getting tight and just spins. The bolt in question is circled in the picture below. I ended up using a steel epoxy to coat the threads on the bolt and tightening it down as much as it would go. I waited a day and then finished the installation of the rack.

The bolt was still not as tight as the other ones so my major concern is that I've now created an intrusion point for water to leak into the vehicle. Is that the case or does this bolt hole only open up to the waterproof canal that runs underneath the raised plastic rail?

View attachment 193380


As for the structural integrity issues this may cause for the rack itself, the loose bolt is only 1 out of 8 bolts that hold the feet so once the rack was on it felt very secure and did not wobble or move by the stripped bolt. So hopefully this is not an issue.

Anyway, thank you for any information that can be provided.

I doubt that the threads on the bolt are stripped. The bolt goes into a captive nut, and what probably happened is the captive nut rotated. The only way to fix is to remove the head liner to access the captive nut. Thus, you should have plenty of strength because the nut is still holding the bolt down.

Not quite sure how to keep water from getting past the "loose" bolt.

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

I doubt that the threads on the bolt are stripped. The bolt goes into a captive nut, and what probably happened is the captive nut rotated. The only way to fix is to remove the head liner to access the captive nut. Thus, you should have plenty of strength because the nut is still holding the bolt down.

Not quite sure how to keep water from getting past the "loose" bolt.

Thank you for the reply but I don't believe the threads on the bolt are stripped, but rather on the hole that it's supposed to secure into. The bolt in question, when removed, had a void underneath it and no captive nut attached to the bottom.

 

[FKHeath]

Thank you for the reply but I don't believe the threads on the bolt are stripped, but rather on the hole that it's supposed to secure into. The bolt in question, when removed, had a void underneath it and no captive nut attached to the bottom.

Oh, there is a nut there. Shows right on the diagram in your post. Part numbers 90179-08247 and 90178-A0093. They came loose from the "capture" and have fallen away.

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

Oh, there is a nut there. Shows right on the diagram in your post. Part numbers 90179-08247 and 90178-A0093. They came loose from the "capture" and have fallen away.

We seem to be looking at different parts on the diagram. The one I'm dealing with is Part 90109-06293/A0032 and is circled on the top right of the picture.

I think the numbers you listed are on the bottom left and were actually just the focus of another thread on here recently.

 

[FKHeath]

We seem to be looking at different parts on the diagram. The one I'm dealing with is Part 90109-06293/A0032 and is circled on the top right of the picture.

I think the numbers you listed are on the bottom left and were actually just the focus of another thread on here recently.

You are right. The bolt you circled screws into the plate below, 63473/4 and there is no nut below. If you stripped the threads in the plate (easy to see with a visual inspection) you really have only one choice: replace the plate which involves removing the head liner to access the mounting nuts below.

I guess you could use a TimeSert (++ TIME-SERT Official Threaded inserts for stripped threads, blown out sparkplugs,) or helicoil, but you would risk drilling through the inner sheet metal to install those. Another option might be to tap the plate with the next size larger thread (use a bottom tap so you don't damage the sheet metal below).

BTW, the torque spec on that bolt is only 106 in-oz which is quite low.

Another BTW, there is no risk of water leaking into the roof liner for all the water seals on the 5th generation RAV4 are via foam washers on the plastic mounting posts 63451/3.

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

The bolt in question is circled in the picture below.

You don't mention which model year your RAV4 is but the bolt you circled goes into the metal bracket and is a threaded "blind hole" which does not penetrate into the cabin--at least on the pre 2022 models.

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

I guess you could use a TimeSert (++ TIME-SERT Official Threaded inserts for stripped threads, blown out sparkplugs,) or helicoil, but you would risk drilling through the inner sheet metal to install those. Another option might be to tap the plate with the next size larger thread (use a bottom tap so you don't damage the sheet metal below).

Tapping the hole to next size larger thread is probably the best option. At one time Loctite and other companies made thread repair kits involving a coating for the bolt (to prevent welding into the hole) and a second mixture you stuffed into the hole (to make new threads.) Then you screwed in the bolt and let it set to cure. I used this stuff successfully to repair the 10mm timing belt cover bolt holes in the aluminum head on my VW Scirocco slalom racer and could torque them to at least 25 ft. lbs.

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

Another BTW, there is no risk of water leaking into the roof liner for all the water seals on the 5th generation RAV4 are via foam washers on the plastic mounting posts 63451/3.

The foam seals are only on pre -2022 models which use plastic clips to attach the roof rails through holes in the roof. 2022 and up have a completely new threaded stud and nut (inside the cabin) mounting system. I and others would dispute the claim that the orange foam washers would successfully prevent water leaks into the cabin long term over the years.

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

You don't mention which model year your RAV4 is but the bolt you circled goes into the metal bracket and is a threaded "blind hole" which does not penetrate into the cabin--at least on the pre 2022 models.

Forgive me, I have a 2021 Rav4 Prime.

So, the risk is still that if that "blind hole" leaks, it would allow water into that canal-like space underneath the plastic housing which would build up because there's no place to drain and potentially end up defeating a seal somewhere?

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

Forgive me, I have a 2021 Rav4 Prime.

So, the risk is still that if that "blind hole" leaks, it would allow water into that canal-like space underneath the plastic housing which would build up because there's no place to drain and potentially end up defeating a seal somewhere?

The "canal-like space" gets water in it all the time whenever it rains or you go through a car wash. That water just evaporates or trickles out eventually down the windshield and the rear hatch after making its way past the plastic clips and brackets. That's why the seals on the clips are so important.The blind hole in the roof bracket with your stripped threads is solid metal in the bottom--it can't ever leak into the roof channel no matter if the bolt is screwed in it or not. Stick a small diameter straw or wire down it and you will feel it's solid. In photo circled bolt is in the bracket where your threads are stripped. Second photo shows that bolt removed and the hole in bracket and threads.

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

The "canal-like space" gets water in it all the time whenever it rains or you go through a car wash. That water just evaporates or trickles out eventually down the windshield and the rear hatch after making its way past the plastic clips and brackets. That's why the seals on the clips are so important.The blind hole in the roof bracket with your stripped threads is solid metal in the bottom--it can't ever leak into the roof channel no matter if the bolt is screwed in it or not. Stick a small diameter straw or wire down it and you will feel it's solid. In photo circled bolt is in the bracket where your threads are stripped. Second photo shows that bolt removed and the hole in bracket and threads. View attachment 193398 View attachment 193399

Thank you very much for the further explanation and photos. So water leakage is a non-issue (as it pertains to this particular problem), but I can tap the hole and size it up to create a tight connection with the roof rack.

In your estimation, would a tighter connection to that plastic plate really increase the strength/stability of the roof rack much? On principle I know things should be made to work as they're supposed to, but it's also going to be a hassle to remove the whole thing so I wonder if the pain outweighs the gain here.

 

[FKHeath]

In your estimation, would a tighter connection to that plastic plate really increase the strength/stability of the roof rack much? On principle I know things should be made to work as they're supposed to, but it's also going to be a hassle to remove the whole thing so I wonder if the pain outweighs the gain here.

Plastic plate? The plate that the mounting bolts screw into is metal (63473/4). Looking closely at the threaded hole in my plate, there seems to be two levels of threads which leads me to suspect there is a nut welded to the bottom of the plate.

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

In your estimation, would a tighter connection to that plastic plate really increase the strength/stability of the roof rack much?

ALL my advice to you is based on my assumption that your 2021 Prime has the "flush" or "low mount" roof rails as shown in your diagram in your first post which are also on 2021 gas model XLEs and LEs. If your Prime has the "high" or "raised" rails like on a TRD then my advice may be no good. On the low flush mount rails the four (two on each side) 10mm bolts in question are the main attachment for the plastic roof rails. The plastic clips with the seals are a much weaker attachment just to keep the rail from flexing or warping up in the center. Some people permanently plug the roof holes and remove the plastic clips and rely entirely on the 10mm bolts to hold on the rails which don't weigh a lot. Now here is the deal with regards to your Front Runner Slimline 2 basket. First, it weighs a lot more than just the plastic roof rail by itself. Second, the SlimLine saddle brackets (item 3 in their diagrams) actually uses two bolts to attach each item 3 to the OEM RAV4 bracket--not just the one you stripped. If you look at the OEM RAV4 mounting brackets, there are actually two threaded holes -- The front hole for the 10mm mounting bolt for the plastic roof rail (circled in red) and a second threaded blind hole halfway back on the OEM bracket which is for attaching the factory cross bars. So even with the thread-stripped hole you have a second bolt holding on the SlimLine. Now that OEM bracket is metal--not plastic. Would it be better for the roof basket strength and stability to fix the OEM bracket threads? Yes, no doubt. Does the pain of repair outweigh the gain in stability and strength? Only you can answer that. If the basket and all your gear rips off the roof on the highway then in hindsight you will wish you had fixed the hole threads. You DO have that second item 3 bracket bolt supplying strength to the mount in addition to the stripped bolt hole so maybe you will be OK. Only time will tell.

 

[rberman999]

I’ve seen a lot of good advice here in this thread. I’ll say if it were me I’d thread the hole to a larger bolt. I’d also use a fine thread and likely use an SAE thread rather than metric. The reason, you might just get away with cutting new threads using a slightly larger SAE bolt and not have to increase the existing hole size. Often times the SAE bolt will be big enough to allow new threads by way of just tapping the hole. Good luck.

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

Plastic plate? The plate that the mounting bolts screw into is metal (63473/4). Looking closely at the threaded hole in my plate, there seems to be two levels of threads which leads me to suspect there is a nut welded to the bottom of the plate.

Yeah, I agree. I didn't initially realize it tied into the same plate.

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

ALL my advice to you is based on my assumption that your 2021 Prime has the "flush" or "low mount" roof rails as shown in your diagram in your first post which are also on 2021 gas model XLEs and LEs. If your Prime has the "high" or "raised" rails like on a TRD then my advice may be no good. On the low flush mount rails the four (two on each side) 10mm bolts in question are the main attachment for the plastic roof rails. The plastic clips with the seals are a much weaker attachment just to keep the rail from flexing or warping up in the center. Some people permanently plug the roof holes and remove the plastic clips and rely entirely on the 10mm bolts to hold on the rails which don't weigh a lot. Now here is the deal with regards to your Front Runner Slimline 2 basket. First, it weighs a lot more than just the plastic roof rail by itself. Second, the SlimLine saddle brackets (item 3 in their diagrams) actually uses two bolts to attach each item 3 to the OEM RAV4 bracket--not just the one you stripped. If you look at the OEM RAV4 mounting brackets, there are actually two threaded holes -- The front hole for the 10mm mounting bolt for the plastic roof rail (circled in red) and a second threaded blind hole halfway back on the OEM bracket which is for attaching the factory cross bars. So even with the thread-stripped hole you have a second bolt holding on the SlimLine. Now that OEM bracket is metal--not plastic. Would it be better for the roof basket strength and stability to fix the OEM bracket threads? Yes, no doubt. Does the pain of repair outweigh the gain in stability and strength? Only you can answer that. If the basket and all your gear rips off the roof on the highway then in hindsight you will wish you had fixed the hole threads. You DO have that second item 3 bracket bolt supplying strength to the mount in addition to the stripped bolt hole so maybe you will be OK. Only time will tell. View attachment 193431 View attachment 193432 View attachment 193433

First of all, thank you very much for taking the time to explain this in the detail you have. I have a much clearer understanding of the build and function of each part as a result.

That being said, and just to be sure, this is my actual vehicle:

Those appear to be "low mount" roof rails to me, but I tried searching for Rav4 Primes with TRD-esque "raised/high" rails and couldn't find anything so I thought I'd put this in here for confirmation.

Now, understanding the role of that bolt better, I plan on correcting the issue and getting a tight fit again. To that end, are there any recommendations on the best method? I've been looking up several options and was leaning towards the use of a helicoil, but I'm not sure that's viable given the shallow depth of that hole...
Also, many people have noted how crucial it is to achieve a direct, straight up 90' approach when tapping the hole. Are the tolerances on this kind of repair so tight that I can't just eyeball that?

 

[ToyoptimusPrime]

I’ve seen a lot of good advice here in this thread. I’ll say if it were me I’d thread the hole to a larger bolt. I’d also use a fine thread and likely use an SAE thread rather than metric. The reason, you might just get away with cutting new threads using a slightly larger SAE bolt and not have to increase the existing hole size. Often times the SAE bolt will be big enough to allow new threads by way of just tapping the hole. Good luck.

That's an interesting point! For ease, I'd like to retain the same bolt so I was leaning towards using a helicoil, but I will keep your idea in mind for any future occurrences.

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

this is my actual vehicle:

Those appear to be "low mount" roof rails to me,

Yes-those are indeed the low, flush mount rails on your RAV.

 

[Tazio Nuvolari]

Now, understanding the role of that bolt better, I plan on correcting the issue and getting a tight fit again. To that end, are there any recommendations on the best method?

Just tapping to larger size is probably best.