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Discussion Starter #1
This is coming from a different thread. My 97 won't start it crank strong have spark but is having code p0336. So far have get help from some members ( Elle) they have been extremely helpful. Check crankshaft position resistance is 1345ohms. Be checking the distributor gap and resistance along with the wire. Thanks again for your help guys
 

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Discussion Starter #2
According to the manuals the gap between the pick up coil and the signal rotor on the distributor should be .008 to .018 thousands. In my distributor it was way more than that ( close to 1/16). Guess it moved thru time and assembly and disassemble. Will that affect the fuel pump? I tap the little shaft and reset the gap back to specs. Spark was never lost, still can feel the EFI Relay activated and the circuit opening relay also activated. Fuel pump is good was test with power supply from battery. Does the igniter have something to do with this? Thanks in advance for the help
 

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To review information Luis posted in another thread recently:
"Have check[ed] the plugs and spray[ed] with contact cleaner. Have followed the wire to the fire wall and it looks good hasn't check the sensor itself. Already replaced the EFI Relay it was crack so just change it for precautions, change the circuit opening relay, it crack on my hands trying to take it out. Fuel pump is good ( test it on 12 v) check and test the pigtail that plug from plug to fuel pump and was good. Change the distributor assembly ( Have bought last year a cheap eBay one, old one was good just didn't want the oil leak). Crankshaft position sensor is new bought at O'Reilly. Only thing I think is messing me is the crankshaft timing belt sprocket ( don't know the proper name,). If you or anyone knows what I am missing I will appreciate the help. Have pull the RAVY twice home and is my wife and kid getting stranded."
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"Last week it was blowing the 15 amp fuse for EFI. I suspected it was fuel pump problem. I have brand new pump I bought last year so I swapped it and wasn't it. Swapped the EFI Relay and it came to life. All that time it have the code I will erase it with scanner and even unplug battery and it comes back when rev pass 2000 rpm. It never showed at idle. That's why I change the crankshaft position sensor. It was running good but code show even faster now even at idle and when erase it it pop right away. Wife run it for almost 3-4 days and leave her at Wally world parking lot. Pull it home and put new EFI Relay and circuit opening relay. Start working again and run for couple days but the code just keep popping. Change the distributor back to old one thinking they were related code. Follow wires and make sure everything was well protect. Car runs for a day or two and leave wife stranded at church. She says before it happened it crank longer than normal. That's why I suspect the tooth on timing belt sprocket. But I am open to suggestions and thanks again for the help"
 

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-- Luis, to confirm: Since the day you replaced the fuse for the EFI relay, has it blown? Or has the fuse been fine?

-- At this point, are you unable to get the Rav running for even short trips?

-- Are the spark plug wires connected to the correct terminals on the distributor? #1 cylinder is on the passenger side of the Rav4. Or when a person is standing in front of the Rav4 with the hood open, facing the engine bay, #1 cylinder is on the person's far left. The ignition cable for the #1 cylinder should connect to the 4 o'clock position on the distributor.
#1 cylinder = 4 o'clock position on the distributor
#3 cylinder = 2 o'clock position on the distributor
#4 cylinder = 10 o'clock position on the distributor
#2 cylinder = 8 o'clock position on the distributor
(Firing order is 1, 3, 4, 2. The distributor rotor rotates counter-clockwise.) From moderator Mick Hatzo:
149899

From another site, for the 1996-1997 3SFE engine:
149900


-- When was the timing belt last changed? The threads I am seeing where the p0336 problem was solved ended up involving either a timing belt malfunction; a timing belt tensioner malfunction; a reluctor tooth on the crankshaft sprocket; or similar. E.g. see Crankshaft Position Sensor . If your Rav4 is now not running for even short trips, then I like the theory that the timing belt slipped a bit but still allowed the engine to run; then the belt slipped more and now it won't run for more than a second or so, due to the timing being off. This could also then cause the p0336 code.

-- On 1996-97 Rav4, a person can check the position of the camshaft by removing the distributor cap. Then the question becomes whether the camshaft position corresponds to the correct position of the crankshaft. If the two positions are not in synch, then this points to a timing belt problem. See below for my exact instructions. Though you sound plenty sharp and can maybe figure out what I mean. A link to what I believe is the full factory service manual appears at the end of this post.

-- An impressive, step-by-step video of changing the 1996-2000 Rav4 timing belt appears at
. Demoder's and others' posts on changing the timing belt at the following thread are also excellent: DIY - Timing belt. I think the video is the better starting point. As you watch the video and proceed with the timing belt replacement, when questions arise, go to the thread, especially for more information about home-made tools.

-- Since you have been going back and forth between two distributors, and you checked the gap on the pickup coil (= camshaft position sensor), I do not think either the distributor or pickup coil is the problem.

-- Sensor resistance looks fine.

-- I do not suspect the igniter or ignition coil at this time, mostly because the p0336 code is consistently being thrown, and because spark is good.

-- All or nearly all of the factory service manual for the 1996-97 Rav4 appears at Toyota Rav4 1996 Service and Repair Manual + Wiring | Free Download
 

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Here is how I would do a quick check of whether the timing is set correctly on a 1996-97 Rav4:

1.
Leave engine off. Put the emergency brake on. Block the wheels. Put the transmission in neutral. Put the front right side on a jackstand. Remove the front right wheel.

2.
On the lower timing belt cover, look for the timing marks. See the one-page attachment for help with this. The bottom-most drawing shows the timing marks.

3.
Look for the notch on the crankshaft pulley.

4.
Get a 19mm socket and large breaker bar. Put the 19mm socket on the crankshaft pulley bolt. With the breaker bar and socket, rotate the crankshaft pulley, but in the clockwise direction only. (Do not rotate counter-clockwise. Rotating counter clockwise will relieve tension and may mess up the timing.) To make rotation a lot easier, remove the spark plugs.

5.
Rotate the crankshaft pulley so that the pulley's notch aligns with the 10 degree position on the lower timing belt cover. This puts the #1 cylinder at 10 degrees before top dead center (BTDC). If the #1 cylinder is on its compression (and not exhaust) stroke, 10 degrees BTDC is about when the #1 cylinder spark plug should fire.

6.
Remove the distributor cap. Does the distributor rotor point to either the 4 o'clock position (= #1 cylinder firing position) or the 10 o'clock position (= #4 cylinder firing position)?

7.
Remember that, in normal operation, the crankshaft rotates two revolutions for every one revolution of the camshaft.

8.
If the distributor rotor is not close to either (a) the 4 o'clock position or (b) the 10 o'clock position, then this suggests the timing belt slipped or maybe even broke.

9.
You can rotate the crankshaft more and have someone watch the distributor rotor. If the distributor rotor does not seem to be moving in synch with the crankshaft, then this would also suggest to me that the timing belt is slipping or broken.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Men that is lot of information. I will have to name my unborn child after you ?. Timing belt is good I checked when replace the CPS. The ohms on distributor are good and I am not sure by taping and getting the the gap right I am keeping that distributor my have to save some mula and buy a Toyota distributor. I took the fuel pump out again ( didn't sleep last night) and try to energized it on the plug and it did nothing then I energized it on the pump itself and it works. After inspection I noticed ( I have like 6 of those pumps, yep Toyo addic) that the positive and negative pins at the pumps varied in thickness depending on the brand (don't know if that will help some other guys that may run in same problem) swapped pump to the one with wider pins and it works when energized on plug. To the question of the blowing fuse, no it hasn't blow it anymore. Will take the seats out and carpet today and trace the wires because I noticed they go under backseat are and with the use and move around in the back I suspect there may be broken wire under.
I do have a question. Since I been messing so much with the distributor plug and from time and oil the plug desintegrate in my hands there is a black and a light color wire. Is the black negative and the light color one positive?if so how do they go on the distributor? I have another pigtail but don't want to plug them wrong.
 

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-- Regarding the two wires to the distributor's pickup coil (a.k.a. camshaft position sensor): The attached electrical wiring diagram on pdf page 58 (marked on the page itself as page 60) shows a red wire and a white wire. The red wire is marked positive and terminal "1." The white wire is marked negative and is terminal "2." PDF page 173 shows the connector and identifies which terminal is 1 and which is 2. Look at the connector (male or female) side that has not disintegrated and see if you can identify terminals 1 and 2. You may need some Simple Green cleaner to get off the grime on the original wires and confirm the colors. Make sure the connections are secure. As I know you know, either a bad connection or the wires being reversed could absolutely be the problem here.

-- the 1996 Rav4 Diagnostics section of the manual on page DI-59 shows a black wire (+ and terminal 1 of the connector) and a white wire (- and terminal 2) go to the pickup coil.

-- If the problem is not the distributor pickup coil (= camshaft position sensor), I think it is still possible that the timing belt slipped. This is not uncommon. I would do the relatively easy check I described above.

-- I cannot quite follow what checks you did on the fuel pump motor but trust your judgement. From reports here usually the problem with symptoms like yours turns out not to be the fuel pump. Especially given the p0336 code.

-- I see a few reports that a bad ignition coil can lead to a camshaft position sensor code, especially if the ignition coil is physically close to the pickup coil wires. Also the wiring for the pickup coil being too close to any other wiring can lead to the code.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
What I mean is the fuel pump itself have a + an - pins in which the short pigtail plug and it also plug to the fuel pump, sending unit connector. The pins on the fuel pump are different on some pumps and the one pump I have ( eBay cheap they were skinny ) and in the Denso i just installed are almost twice as wide. This makes me wonder if that creates false contact and is messing with me. Will trace wires tonight and update tomorrow. As always really appreciate your help
 

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Try some heat shrink and crimp, butt splice connectors from Harbor Freight or Home Depot?

But I think I know what you mean about the pins. I do not think a skinny pin not mating well with the female side would cause the problem. Though while you are diagnosing, make sure the pins are connected securely.

Plus the code P0336 should not be caused by bad pin connections at the fuel pump. I would stay focused on what is causing the code, because whatever is causing the code is most likely the cause of the no-start.

I have had the Rav4 fuel pump assemblies apart a few times. As needed:
The fuel pump motor should have a "+" and a "-" symbol stamped next to its electrical terminals. I had to look a little closely on some pumps to see the + and - symbols. PDF page 170 of the previously attached set of wiring diagrams shows the wire colors going to the fuel pump:
Blue with black stripe = positive wire
White with black stripe = negative wire (ground)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Well after a wire chasing, praying, diagram study , meditation and couple of ice cold beer weekend and off course your help, finally the RAVY is running. Will share my findings with y'all. First the wires that go from the ECU to my distributor at least on my 97 are not like the ones on the manuals. The red one + on the manual diagrams is black on my 97 and the white - on the manual diagrams that connects to the negative wire on the crankshaft position sensor is almost pink on mine. Thanks to the plugs identification number and tracing got the new plug assembly and fix. Also I tap the distributor air gap back to specs ( will be buying new one soon) I noticed the cranking and starting of the motor are faster now. To my shame but have to said it. The fuel pump was coming to life but sounds weird and wasn't delivering fuel, after wire tracing and ground checking and this the part I don't understand the terminals 4 and 5 on the fuel pump connector on the fuel tank are in opposite position from the manual diagram. After inverting the wires on the short pigtail that runs from the connector to the fuel pump itself it start working magnificent. So my previous fuel pump was running backwards and still delivering fuel or so I think and probably after a day quit is my only explanation or I leave it to those with higher IQ to explain. So I am in gratitude for your help and hope this may be going thru the same or will be. I have only own my RAVY for close to 6 years and before that it was abandoned by the previous owner so not sure what if anything he did to it or if he swapped the wires. If I am missing something that I should do please let me know.
 

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Regarding the fuel pump connector and terminals 4 and 5: I wonder if the problem was that you were looking at, say, the female side of the connector in a drawing while what you had in your hand was the male side? For me, identifying whether I am looking at a connector's female side or male side usually requires several minutes of study of the drawing of the connector in the electrical section of the manual, combined with checking the wire colors and maybe doing some multimeter checks. Granted the wire colors in the manual are not always a perfect match to what is actually on the vehicle. Nice update.
 

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Well that could be the explanation plus I spend almost two days without sleep trying to fix this problem. I be keeping the RAVY for me. Looks like be getting mama a 2014 RAVY soon. But the 97 be my playing with car. ( Is pay for and good shape) Thanks again for the help.
 
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