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My Jeep Cherokee is coming off lease in July, and I had a V6 Rav4 previously for 7 years. I planned on getting a new Rav4 Hybrid come July, but watching this forum, with the pounding of one problem after another -- the fuel filling issue, dead batteries, cold weather starting, engine block recall -- I've just about given up on the vehicle. I was also thinking about the Rav4 Prime, but with Toyota being unable to keep the regular Hybrid on the road I can't see going with the first-model-year Prime. I'm hoping to see a cascade of Hybrid fixes in the next month or two, but I'm not optimistic at this point. Very disappointing.
 

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IMO, if the fueling issue isn't resolved by July 2020, it ain't ever gonna be.
 

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Yup, lots of different issues. IMO, the new gen has been a bad launch. These are the risk of first year remodel. Don't know what else to add. I am also shopping for a replacement vehicle for my mother and it's not easy as they all seems to have issues. Some more severe then other, so I guess it's a pick which issue you prefer?

I know for myself, I don't have the fueling issue, I had the cold starting issue, but has been fixed. Engine block recall is a limited amount of affected cars for now. The dead batteries issue, from what I've seen it seems to be a parasite drawn of some kind, I have a June 2019 built hybrid and my battery is fine even after being parked for 7 days, it started right up in -20 Celsius.

That why I got an extended warranty when I bought this car. Had a relay and 2 struts replaced under warranty so far. Other than rattles, I am satisfied with my hybrid so far.
 

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So what are your other options in the same category? Are they trouble free
If you must get an hybrid SUV, the alternative are extremely limited. The CR-V is getting an hybrid powertrain, but again, first year and Honda hybrid track record seems to not be great. Ford have the hybrid escape, but man these thing are much smaller.

If you don't need hybrid, the CX-5 has been reliable from what I see on forum and we have 2 in our family with nothing major happening.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
So what are your other options in the same category? Are they trouble free
There's the Mazda CX-5 Turbo, the Subaru Outback Turbo. It's the only others I'm considering. They're both relatively trouble-free. The Outback is a capable vehicle, but I'm not sure I can get used to the wagon-look. I'm tending to favor the CX-5 right now. Can't find much bad about it, except for a dated infotainment system, slightly lower ground clearance, and less cargo space.
 

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If you must get an hybrid SUV, the alternative are extremely limited. The CR-V is getting an hybrid powertrain, but again, first year and honda hybrid track record seems to not be great. Ford have the hybrid escape, but man these thing are much smaller.

If you don't need hybrid, the cx-5 has been reliable from what I see on forum and we have 2 in our family with nothing major happening.
I wanted a hybrid, but the choices in the segment are extremely limited, if you have to take the Rav4 out of the equation. I'm not a fan of the minivan look of the CR-V, and Ford vehicles, ehhh.
 

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I guess I'm not discerning enough or I got the only good 2020 Rav4 Hybrid Limited. I picked it up on January 3rd and really like it and would buy it again. I have made some changes like lighted switches, dome light LED's, turn signal LED's. Unfortunately forums primarily exist to discuss problems and anything wrong with a particular model or year. Check out other car model forums and you'll find the same thing. The Harley forums are really critical. I hope you find a great car than you'll really like.
Bill
 

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Then there are those of us who are overall very happy with our Rav4 hybrids. Yes, we have the tank issue but otherwise it has been reliable and a pleasure to drive, getting close to 14,000 miles. The Toyota hybrid drive train design has proven to be super reliable. My nearly 11 Y.O. Prius runs like new and I expect the same from the Rav.
 

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Then there are those of us who are overall very happy with our Rav4 hybrids. Yes, we have the tank issue but otherwise it has been reliable and a pleasure to drive, getting close to 14,000 miles. The Toyota hybrid drive train design has proven to be super reliable. My nearly 11 Y.O. Prius runs like new and I expect the same from the Rav.
Reason why I got the Rav4H, hoping I can expect the same trouble free from the major drive component like the prius people. I can deal with little issue and annoyances.
 

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I wanted a hybrid, but the choices in the segment are extremely limited, if you have to take the Rav4 out of the equation. I'm not a fan of the minivan look of the CR-V, and Ford vehicles, ehhh.
There's always the last gen Highlanders hybrid, but than again, even the hybrid fuel economy is not great, but then again, I am currently at a point that I would favor reliability and peace of mind of 5-10mpg lol.

When I was shopping, I was going to buy a CR-V, but after reading the oil dilution issue, I was out. If the hybrid drivetrain proves to be reliable, it would be something nice if you don't mind the look.. If I'd wreck my Rav today, I'd either get another one or a used cx-5 or cx-9.
 

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My Jeep Cherokee is coming off lease in July, and I had a V6 Rav4 previously for 7 years. I planned on getting a new Rav4 Hybrid come July, but watching this forum, with the pounding of one problem after another -- the fuel filling issue, dead batteries, cold weather starting, engine block recall -- I've just about given up on the vehicle. I was also thinking about the Rav4 Prime, but with Toyota being unable to keep the regular Hybrid on the road I can't see going with the first-model-year Prime. I'm hoping to see a cascade of Hybrid fixes in the next month or two, but I'm not optimistic at this point. Very disappointing.
Here's my take on those issues:
  • Refuelling. This is annoying, for sure. It's possible to work around it, or to accept that the vehicle just has a huge reserve. And then there's Toyota's silence on the whole thing, which only makes the frustrations worse. But honestly, it doesn't really affect the day-to-day driving. The range isn't that bad even with the problem and no workarounds. Compare it with your Jeep: the highway range (giving the Jeep its best economy and the RAV4 hybrid its worst) is is 427 miles, running the tank to dry. On the RAV4 Hybrid that's about 11.2 gallons of fuel. And if you do the same math with city fuel economy, it's only 7.7 gallons.
  • Dead batteries and cold weather starting. I'm lumping these two together because the cold weather problems are causing at least some of the dead batteries. This is a bigger deal than the refueling problem, IMO, because it can actually leave you stranded. There's a partial explanation (bad relay), with some rumors of a bad batch of batteries, but electrical problems can be frustrating to diagnose and the root cause is probably still unknown. The good news is this problem is much less common than refueling problems.
  • Engine block recall. You can safely ignore this. Consider the volume of cars that Toyota makes (10.7 million in 2019), versus the number of cars that are being recalled (44,000), versus the number of engines that will actually need to be fixed (250). Yes, this sucks for those that end up being affected. Yes, it's bad that this problem slipped past Quality Control. But, in the grand scheme of things, this isn't a big deal. And it won't be a problem at all once you're ready to replace your Jeep.
  • Fuel economy. You didn't mention this one, but it's a common point of discussion. Many people get the RAV4 Hybrid because of its excellent fuel economy, which means they care more when it comes up short. From what I can tell, the EPA estimates might be a bit high, but by a similar amount as most other cars out there. Cold weather is especially rough on it, though, so expect a big drop in the winter.
Keep in mind that forums are a place for people to come and complain about their cars. And the more popular the vehicle, the more complaints you're going to see. Take the complaints in context: how severe are they, how common are they, how annoying are they, and how have they been mitigated? Apply it to your situation: someone in New Jersey or Oregon will be far more frustrated by the refueling problems, another in Canada might be more impacted by the fuel economy and dead battery. Someone leasing a vehicle for 3 years is going to be more frustrated by a problem that takes a year for Toyota to acknowledge/diagnose/and fix than someone who owns the vehicle for 15 years.
 

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Figure out why you are buying a vehicle, what its planned use will be and try to figure out how well the possible choice will fit your use case. Find a forum and read. I did.

This forum is vocal and negative for some reason with those who don't like a feature endlessly posting. There is another Rav4h forum which doesn't have the same tone to it. And as others have said, how many drivers look at a forum when there are no problems?

I can list far more than 3 things Toyota didn't do right or I wish they had done better. Last count the number was up to 39.

But I can also list lots of things I really like about the car and the good are in the important-to-me categories of why I buy a car and they far outweigh the not so good.

7,200 miles, one oil change.

I pump my own gas and true I can't pump as fast as I want but I can get to the F mark 95+% of the time on the first click. I did today. I did last time. Instead of fussing, I figured out how to make it work. I don't often travel to states where someone else has to pump the gas. I am not frequently far from a gas station. And seldom does an extra half minute matter to me. Nor do I care to run my tank dry or to try to go 600 miles without a stop.

If I had to buy today, I'd go for the Rav4h Prime (Plug In) or the Tesla Model Y. If initial cost was important, I'd buy one of those cars that were bought back by Toyota because of the fueling complaint.

I'm not sure enough Mazda will be around in 5 years with the capitol costs of bring out totally new vehicles. (And I've owned stock in them (not good) and 2 Mazda Sedans that were both good.)
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Here's my take on those issues:
  • Refuelling. This is annoying, for sure. It's possible to work around it, or to accept that the vehicle just has a huge reserve. And then there's Toyota's silence on the whole thing, which only makes the frustrations worse. But honestly, it doesn't really affect the day-to-day driving. The range isn't that bad even with the problem and no workarounds. Compare it with your Jeep: the highway range (giving the Jeep its best economy and the RAV4 hybrid its worst) is is 427 miles, running the tank to dry. On the RAV4 Hybrid that's about 11.2 gallons of fuel. And if you do the same math with city fuel economy, it's only 7.7 gallons.
  • Dead batteries and cold weather starting. I'm lumping these two together because the cold weather problems are causing at least some of the dead batteries. This is a bigger deal than the refueling problem, IMO, because it can actually leave you stranded. There's a partial explanation (bad relay), with some rumors of a bad batch of batteries, but electrical problems can be frustrating to diagnose and the root cause is probably still unknown. The good news is this problem is much less common than refueling problems.
  • Engine block recall. You can safely ignore this. Consider the volume of cars that Toyota makes (10.7 million in 2019), versus the number of cars that are being recalled (44,000), versus the number of engines that will actually need to be fixed (250). Yes, this sucks for those that end up being affected. Yes, it's bad that this problem slipped past Quality Control. But, in the grand scheme of things, this isn't a big deal. And it won't be a problem at all once you're ready to replace your Jeep.
  • Fuel economy. You didn't mention this one, but it's a common point of discussion. Many people get the RAV4 Hybrid because of its excellent fuel economy, which means they care more when it comes up short. From what I can tell, the EPA estimates might be a bit high, but by a similar amount as most other cars out there. Cold weather is especially rough on it, though, so expect a big drop in the winter.
Keep in mind that forums are a place for people to come and complain about their cars. And the more popular the vehicle, the more complaints you're going to see. Take the complaints in context: how severe are they, how common are they, how annoying are they, and how have they been mitigated? Apply it to your situation: someone in New Jersey or Oregon will be far more frustrated by the refueling problems, another in Canada might be more impacted by the fuel economy and dead battery. Someone leasing a vehicle for 3 years is going to be more frustrated by a problem that takes a year for Toyota to acknowledge/diagnose/and fix than someone who owns the vehicle for 15 years.
Thanks for the above. I appreciate it.

1. Refueling. I agree that this is really just an annoyance, and not critical. But the extended range is one of the reasons I like the Hybrid, and it appears that the problem effectively lowers the range. That mutes some of the advantage of the Hybrid for me, even if it doesn't actually affect MPG's.

2. Dead batteries/cold weather starting. I agree these problems are less common, but one of the places my Rav4 will be going regularly is a vacation cabin in Northeast PA, where it gets very cold in the winter. The last thing I would want to have happen is getting stranded there, so it's disconcerting.

3. Engine block recall. I agree that's a limited problem that should not affect vehicles currently being built.

4. Fuel economy. Yes, the Hybrid's MPG's will be a big loss if I go with, for example, a CX-5.

Sometimes things are worth more of the sum of their parts. What I find extremely disappointing is not that the relatively new model is having some issues (a common occurrence with redesigns among all manufacturers, according to Consumer Reports) but that in the case of the fueling, the dead batteries and the cold weather starting Toyota seems to have no clue as to how to address the problems. The fueling problem has gone on though two model years now, and the dead batteries seem to be NEW to the 2020's. Nothing positive to see in these trends.

I understand completely that forums tend to highlight complainers. This is not my first rodeo. And of course there are many people who are happy with their Rav4 Hybrids. However, the fueling issue is not anecdotal, it is widespread, has spurned at least two lawsuits, and yet Toyota still fails to indicate that it has any idea how to fix it. Buying or leasing a car is a commitment to an automobile manufacturer and its michigas for at least several years. And at this point Toyota has lost my confidence.

Having said all of the above I would still prefer the Rav4 Hybrid and will be watching carefully for any positive news.
 

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Very happy with the RAV4 Hybrid AWD. Drove a Mazda CX-5 and was totally frustrated and annoyed with the constant stop-start of the engine at lights. Yes you can turn it off but that has to be done each time you drive - if you remember. At least the hybrid moves 200m or so down the road and the ICE starts almost imperceptibly.
 

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We picked up a 2020 XSEh last month and don't have any of the chronic problems on this forum for our model. Our 2019 XLE had the fuel filling issue, but it wasn't a deal killer. Once I understood what was happening (at least I think I did), there were easy workarounds. But, as I said, our 2020 has none of them. Now if I can just get my wife to let me drive it more...
 

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I'm almost afraid to post anything anymore here, just because of the severe punishment from a lot of negative persons on this forum that don't seem to like foreigners.
But i'm a happy owner, none of the above issues occur with my Dutch hybrid XSE AWD. Minor issues? Sure, but name me one car from another brand without any. And to be true: Toyota treats us well in Europe.
 

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Does Toyota use a different tank in Europe? I have only read about filling issues in the US.

Or do we have different gas pumps from rest of the world.


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