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Well when you're the biggest car seller then you have to expect more problems. QC just isn't as good when you work with high volumes of parts.
 

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Yeah, I agree. Who cares if your brand new car leaves you stranded in the middle of nowhere with a dead battery. Deal with it.
How many 2020 owners have been stranded due to a dead battery? Thousands? I've only heard of a few rare reports.

They don't want to use free roadside assistance so they can pretend they're "stranded"?

Mechanically this isnt a significant problem. Toyota still tends to build the most reliable cars for the long haul.

Even JD admits this study is primarily focused on infotainment etc not long term mechanical reliability

Kia, Dodge others have awful resale value. Ask yourself why that is.
 

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Discussion Starter #26
So, Toyota ranks poorly in Initial Quality and people on here trash Dodge. Makes perfect sense. I
 

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How many 2020 owners have been stranded due to a dead battery? Thousands? I've only heard of a few rare reports.

They don't want to use free roadside assistance so they can pretend they're "stranded"?

Mechanically this isnt a significant problem. Toyota still tends to build the most reliable cars for the long haul.

Even JD admits this study is primarily focused on infotainment etc not long term mechanical reliability

Kia, Dodge others have awful resale value. Ask yourself why that is.
So these are not problems that you care about. Great. You asked a question about the new problems for the 2020s and I answered it. Turn it into something else if you wish.

You live in a city so of course this is how you think. Roadside assistance is everywhere. For those of us that spend a lot of time in rural/remote areas where there is often no cell phone service, roadside assistance is not much help. Yes, people do actually get stranded.
 

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Discussion Starter #28
To Crazyhorse's point, I'll add that just knowing about the issue could give people anxiety about a new car. It doesn't have to actually happen in order to affect them. Do they need to allow an extra hour for every important event in case their battery dies? Some people can block this out. Other people don't have that luxury.
 

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So these are not problems that you care about. Great. You asked a question about the new problems for the 2020s and I answered it. Turn it into something else if you wish.

You live in a city so of course this is how you think. Roadside assistance is everywhere. For those of us that spend a lot of time in rural/remote areas where there is often no cell phone service, roadside assistance is not much help. Yes, people do actually get stranded.
How do you know where I live?

I dont live in a city...
 

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So, Toyota ranks poorly in Initial Quality and people on here trash Dodge. Makes perfect sense. I
Not trashing Dodge. Chrysler has consistent had horribly reliability and very poor resale for at least a decade.

This isnt news and everyone has agreed.

I never understood initial quality studies for the first 90 days. Maybe its important to some I guess.

If you really like a Dodge go buy one. I dont hate Dodge, but I have 30 years of first hand experience how Chrysler reliabilty is because I get the employee discount.

I'd lease but never buy

I'm no Toyota fanboy either. I have BMW in my driveway too. But it ain't as reliable as my Toyota
 

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What part of my post do you disagree with?
All of it. Corporations are driven by profit. Selling products with defects is costly for corporations (own any Boeing stock?). It is cheaper for corporations to minimize defects before the products are sold compared to fixing them after the sale. Certainly with today's technology, mass production on its own is not the root cause of defects and most would agree that it has improved quality overall. Corporations grow because they have learned to efficiently mass produce their products with minimal defects. Toyota has accomplished this better than some other car companies although many see a negative trend.
 

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I see you've never worked in the auto industry or any industry that deals in volume.

It's a fact the more you produce the more defects you will get.

Anyway you're entitled to your opinion.
 

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And the defect rated goes up with volume.


Are you trying to tell me the Toyota cars made today are better quality than say 20 years ago when their volume was much lower?
 

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Well when you're the biggest car seller then you have to expect more problems. QC just isn't as good when you work with high volumes of parts.
In manufacturing this is actually the opposite. The more you produce, the more you can optimize the process, identify areas problems can happen and improve them, spend the money to automate the whole process with robotics, spend more on QC systems like machine vision, etc, etc.

Think about it - if you bake a cake once a year it likely doesn't turn out quite perfectly shaped, etc. If you bake one every day you would get pretty good at it.

This of course is often offset by manufactures - or more often tier suppliers - mentality that if I shave 1 cent off a part I build a million of a year, I just saved $10K, and they end up with other problems - which is where Toyota seems to be heading lately.
 

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Totally false. The more you produce the more chances of having defects.

With the just in time system there is great amount of pressure to get the parts out. With robots when you have a defect it can go without notice for many parts.

In fact there are times when. Manufacturer will put in parts they KNOW may have problems only to let them be fixed by the dealers when they have problems.

The cost of shutting down the line is VERY COSTLY.

I'll give you an example. Toyota has a problem with the fuel tank on the 2019 yet they still sell them without a fix.
 

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JD Power, like all auto surveys, is not perfect but it is recognized by the general public. I think we can agree that Toyota could have done better quality control with the RAV4.

Just posted in the Mechanical Forum by EP 2015.

I bought a brand new RAV4 Hybrid XLE this past weekend and before I was even able to drive it off the lot, the check engine light came on (everything was fine during the test drive). They looked at the car today and determined that the thermostat associated with the water pump was faulty (registering a few degrees off according to the sales manager).

Couple questions: Has any on else experienced a similar issue with a new RAV4 or any car in general? And ive been reassured that its a minor issue however the overall pump system is obviously vital to the engine. Should I be demanding they replace the car with another one?

New 2020 RAV4 Hybrid XLE Thermostat Issue
 
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