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Honestly, I am beginning not to turn up my nose at Hyundai as much as I used to...
Kia too. Their products look impressive especially upcoming EVs


Where Toyota may remain superior is with EV's, because they've got more experience. But ICE? Hmmm....
You got it the other way. How could Toyota be superior with something they haven't built yet? They only built solid ICE powertrains for decades.
 

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In my mind, all Toyota's experience with the Prius and whatnot count towards an EV platform.
It's not the same. As a matter of fact EV powertrains will be reliable across the board for all manufacturers as they are much simpler. It's the battery tech that matters. Who can build long lasting battery packs, with more range and cheaper...
 

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marley
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Toyota and Honda have passed their pinnacles of reliability... I blame it on all the high tech economy stuff mandated by the government.
And more tech to come. All for keeping impaired drivers off the road, but this may be a can of worms.


Carmakers must install technology in new vehicles to detect and stop drunk drivers as part of a requirement included in President Joe Biden's $1 trillion infrastructure bill, AP first reported on Tuesday.

The legislation says the new technology must "passively monitor the performance of a driver of a motor vehicle to accurately identify whether that driver may be impaired" and "prevent or limit motor vehicle operation if an impairment is detected."

Automakers must soon install tech in new cars that can detect and stop drunk drivers, Congress says
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
I traded my 2020 LE hybrid in exactly for that reason, the brittle stiff ride just made for a symphony of rattles. It did not help that the bottom edge of the rear bumper was flapping constantly in the underbody airstream at highway speed. Figured that out and fixed it with zip ties. That very same day the vehicle developed a loud structural groan over uneven pavement. That was the last straw. Sold it back to the dealer for $500 less than I paid for it 18 months and 23,000 miles later. Thank you, current topsy-turvy current market. If I was the kind of driver that liked having music on or radio, I would never notice the rattles but I like to just drive in silence as best I can.
Thinking about it some more; I came to my LE from an EV. Luxury to me isn’t leather and amenities but rather unobtrusive noises during routine driving. Granted, the drivetrains are polar opposites but I never expected the US’s 4th best selling vehicle to have zero sound deadening along with Lego like snap-in plastic panel Interiors. This RAV4 was to replace my 17 year old Honda Element but I’m rethinking that too. I’ll have to ultimately go back to an EV and keep the toaster.
 

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rather unobtrusive noises during routine driving.
Toyota could call it a safety feature which kind of make sense. In my Ford I am isolated from road noise so much that I can't even hear approaching emergency car with blaring siren.
 

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I’m sure I’m in the minority here but after a month with my new car, there’s nothing really inspiring.
While shopping for it vs others, I considered all the usual: value, resale, reliability, economy, etc.
Finding a good vehicle w/o a CVT or DSG transmission narrowed my choice a lot!
My LE has so many rattling, hard plastic snap-in panels, road & engine noise…! Toyota has great stuff but this generation is really constructed lightly and cheaply. IMHO. The performance and handling is kind of medium too. Yeah, I know, the hybrid is better but out of stock and my budget.
I’m adding sound deadening mats this week to help hush up this tin can.
Just rambling, venting with buyer’s remorse In this worst of all times for auto shopping. So, not much to to consider swapping for..
go ahead, roast me
You are calling a spade a spade I to have a Rav4 and it's a one and done for me. The little crossover from Chev. has more smarts then the Rav after remote start stays running while you put two kids in and strap them in, the Chev knows who is entering by key fob wife and I have different seat settings, I have to wait for seat move before I can Get in. The Chev moves seat for who ever remote starts and stays running when you open doors and you are right about engine noise no pad under hood on gas Ravs but on Hybrid they have a pad for noise reduction? da. One power seat and no option to get passenger power seat?
 

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The legislation says the new technology must "passively monitor the performance of a driver of a motor vehicle to accurately identify whether that driver may be impaired" and "prevent or limit motor vehicle operation if an impairment is detected."
Great... That's all we need - more tech that's just going to cause more problems than it solves. Who asked for all this crap? Our country legitimately needs a lot of investment into our infrastructure, and stuff like this just derails the process.

Meanwhile, car prices keep going up, but things like this won't make them any more reliable or last any longer...
 

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You are calling a spade a spade I to have a Rav4 and it's a one and done for me. The little crossover from Chev. has more smarts then the Rav after remote start stays running while you put two kids in and strap them in, the Chev knows who is entering by key fob wife and I have different seat settings, I have to wait for seat move before I can Get in. The Chev moves seat for who ever remote starts and stays running when you open doors and you are right about engine noise no pad under hood on gas Ravs but on Hybrid they have a pad for noise reduction? da. One power seat and no option to get passenger power seat?
Gotta love the Chevy's low hanging rear suspension which looks like it was made from my kid's Erector Set.

Automotive tail & brake light Automotive side marker light Vehicle registration plate Tire Car
 

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Great... That's all we need - more tech that's just going to cause more problems than it solves. Who asked for all this crap? Our country legitimately needs a lot of investment into our infrastructure, and stuff like this just derails the process.

Meanwhile, car prices keep going up, but things like this won't make them any more reliable or last any longer...
That's what they said about ABS and airbags too.
 

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Back to the OP, Alnvilma wrote
"While shopping for it (RAV4) vs others, I considered all the usual: value, resale, reliability, economy, etc".


Anyway , if I was buying an SUV ICE car, same size as the RAV4 , I would buy another Subaru Forester. We leased one in 2017 for 3 years. Except for climbing long hills, the CVT is quiet, and soundproofing in the car is pretty good. Great visibility driving it and the 4X4 system is bombproof. Subaru also extended the CVT warranty to 10 years, 100,000 miles.
We nearly bought a new Forester, last month; but one dealer wanted MSRP, for a 2021 Demo with 16,500 miles on it. Next dealer would order one for us, but it had $4000 in add-ons, even $68 for licence plate frames . WTF !
So we decided to try our first Toyota , with a RAV4 Hybrid AWD on order, to offset the fuel cost of our other car, a Subaru Tribeca. . Friends have owned Prius Hybrids, and really liked the car. I sat in a friends RAV4 Hybrid and was impressed. Thought about the plug-in Prime, but couldn't find one, and couldn't justify the extra $10,000. Plus dealer markup of $4-5000. And waiting for a Prime, coming form Japan.
So if you want an SUV ICE car, buy a Subaru Forester?

ps.We "should" be getting our RAV4 Hybrid (Loser Edition) . this week. MSRP.
 

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Back to the OP, Alnvilma wrote
"While shopping for it (RAV4) vs others, I considered all the usual: etc".


Anyway , if I was buying an SUV ICE car, same size as the RAV4 , I would buy another Subaru Forester. We leased one in 2017 for 3 years. Except for climbing long hills, the CVT is quiet, and soundproofing in the car is pretty good. Great visibility driving it and the 4X4 system is bombproof. Subaru also extended the CVT warranty to 10 years, 100,000 miles.
We nearly bought a new Forester, last month; but one dealer wanted MSRP, for a 2021 Demo with 16,500 miles on it. Next dealer would order one for us, but it had $4000 in add-ons, even $68 for licence plate frames . WTF !
So we decided to try our first Toyota , with a RAV4 Hybrid AWD on order, to offset the fuel cost of our other car, a Subaru Tribeca. . Friends have owned Prius Hybrids, and really liked the car. I sat in a friends RAV4 Hybrid and was impressed. Thought about the plug-in Prime, but couldn't find one, and couldn't justify the extra $10,000. Plus dealer markup of $4-5000. And waiting for a Prime, coming form Japan.
So if you want an SUV ICE car, buy a Subaru Forester?

ps.We "should" be getting our RAV4 Hybrid (Loser Edition) . this week. MSRP.
To each it's own. Subaru in our family considered POS with cvt transmission failure at 30k.

"value, resale, reliability, economy" - if you add "fun" to this formula then it becomes "in your dreams"
 
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