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VSC, ABS, 4WD and BRAKE lights always ON while engine is running.

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c.bogoy

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Hi guys...

I know that similar topics exists related to the above subject but this issue came up after repairs were done at the body shop to fix the rear-end collision damage. The shop rep told me that they never touched anything under the hood. The vehicle was in the shop for 2 weeks during a -20C to -30C weather. The body repair shop wants to bring my RAV4 to the dealership and wants me to shoulder the expenses if they find the problem not related to the collision. This problem never existed before, in fact, I've been driving my RAV4 every day for a month after the accident before bringing it into the body repair shop.

Is there a chance a weak battery triggered this problem? Or this has something to do with sensors, what do you think?

Please HELP... Thanks in advance.
 
#2 ·
When those lights flash, the issue is not always "under the hood". A rear end crash can damage sensors in the exhaust and wheel area which will cause all those lights to be thrown. Honestly I would complain to your insurance agent and tell them what's going on. You shouldn't have to run around to get your car fixed. Repair shops are suppose to fix everything not just what is seen cosmetically.
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
Zeoth.. Thanks for the advice.

I already called my insurance and was told that if the problem is related to the collision then I won't have to spend anything. Those lights never came on permanently before the vehicle was brought in for body repair so they must have screwed the sensors. To me, this is indirectly related to the accident even though it happened after the body work.

If this was only a case of a weak battery then it's on me since the battery is already 3 years old and have experienced extreme winter conditions.
 
#4 ·
Well if it's the battery sure you are responsible to replace it. Similarly if the brake pads are worn down the accident didn't cause it. I doubt the accident damaged the battery so a weak batter means it's on you.

I also doubt it's the battery since you can start your car. A problem battery = hard time cranking or no cranking at all.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
There was a similar thread where another member mentioned the possibility of a weak battery so it led me to consider the situation after 2 weeks idle at -20C to -30C weather.

The most logical cause would be the bad sensors, the body repair tech just can't figure it out so they prefer the dealership.

This is the only vehicle I owned right now and it's very well taken cared of. Though not all maintenance were done at the dealership, they were on schedule. I only go to the dealership if it's a mechanical/electrical/electronics problem. If it's just oil change I bring it somewhere.

I put on Bridgestone Blizzak WS-70 winter tires late October when the temperature hit +7C and never experienced any trouble with the sensors since the supplier gave me an equivalent set of tires.

Again, thanks for your input.
 
#6 ·
This is the same light combination as my topic except mine is intermittent not constant.
Since yours didn't happen until the body work it would seem they are at fault. Even reputable shops don't get everything right the first time. But they should take full responsibility for getting ALL the work completed correctly and at their expense.
I'd explain the situation to the insurance company and tell them to notify you when the car is done, by who or how isn't your problem, having a rental at their expense is what you expect.
I suspect they'll find some issue with the tail lights judging from this post:
http://rav4world.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=28831&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=26
 
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Discussion starter · #7 ·
Dr. Dyno... Thanks for the reply.

I just emailed my insurance agent hoping I could get some help with their Claims Department since I'm not happy with the kind of response I'm getting from them.

I was provided with a rental car (front-wheel drive, all-season-tires) from the beginning but it's not suited for the present weather condition, a scary ride most of the time on Edmonton's snow covered - icy roads.

My RAV4 is already at the dealership but I'm not sure how long it will take them to diagnose & fix it.
 
#8 ·
I do not understand how it could be the battery if the lights stay on while the car is running (i.e., getting power from the alternator). Even with the worst of batteries, the car will be fully powered while the power is running.
 
#9 ·
Iamddn said:
I do not understand how it could be the battery if the lights stay on while the car is running (i.e., getting power from the alternator). Even with the worst of batteries, the car will be fully powered while the power is running.
Click to expand...
If the battery is having issues, it may have enough power to turn the lights on but not enough to crank the engine. Even minor fluctuations in power will cause the car to think it's off and thus start lighting up the indicators as if something is wrong.

When my battery was dead, I jumped it and it stayed on. When I drove on it, the car will turn on and off as if I'm shutting down the car and I would even lose power brakes for a split second. All the lights in my dash would light up for a couple seconds when that happens. Now I'm not saying this is the exact scenario but it's one example of how a bad battery can cause those indicators to light up.
 
Discussion starter · #12 ·
Certainly not on me, the body shop was responsible for it.

Lesson learned? Should let the shop acknowledge the condition of the vehicle when it was brought in.

In the Philippines, big time car repair shops and dealerships conduct inspection of your vehicle before accepting it. They will also conduct inventory of your tools and other stuff inside it. Of course you will be advised to remove valuable items inside. All these are done to avoid misunderstanding upon checkout.

Thanks Zeoth...
 
#13 ·
Does anyone have any tips on how to take the connector off at the speed sensor? I'd hate to crack it just taking a look at it. Looks like a gray case that splits in half. Which wheels have speed sensors? All 4? The fronts look a little different if those are speed sensors. Finally, when you check the fault code, will it tell you which wheel it is? Thanks

Darren
 
#14 ·
We (UK) find that our bought / ebay OBDII scanners wont read any ABS or drivetrain error codes only engine ECU codes, ie. if o2 sensor gone or the likes.

Anything that goes through the ABS ECU we have to use the shorting wire trick to get the dash to tell us codes.

A short piece of wire (i just used bit of speaker wire with exposed ends) and with engine off, connect ports 4 & 13 in the diagnostic port,with wire still in place, turn key or press start buttin to ignition 1 (dont start car though), lights flash up on dash and the centre display cycles through the error codes.

Recently in the cold snap, I had intermediate lights coming on, 4x4, VSC, ABS light, done the shorting trick which gave me 33 & 38 = rear right ABS sensor & foreign object on rear right ABS sensor.

The rear connectors are on the inside of the car behind the boot side panel, as new ABS sensor comes with connector and wiring harness as one, the connector feeds through the rubber grommet at the wheel well.

Not sure if this works with you guys but definitely works here in Europe and has saved us a whole heap of money.
 
#15 ·
Smiler AS said:
We (UK) find that our bought / ebay OBDII scanners wont read any ABS or drivetrain error codes only engine ECU codes, ie. if o2 sensor gone or the likes.

Recently in the cold snap, I had intermediate lights coming on, 4x4, VSC, ABS light, done the shorting trick which gave me 33 & 38 = rear right ABS sensor & foreign object on rear right ABS sensor.
Click to expand...
I used an OTC Determinator with System 4.0 that reads ABS codes. It showed the same codes, "rear right ABS sensor & foreign object on rear right ABS sensor."
I tried to clear the codes which the scanner says it did but the lights and error codes are still there. Same codes even after I changed the relay based on a TSB. I'm going to take look at the sensor next.
 
#16 ·
Do the codes come up as soon as you start the car or say after moving off - ie. about 7mph +?
If they come back as soon as car starts, may well be the ABS wiring loom as its detecting no signal at all.
The salt during winter months seem to be especially bad for getting in about the sensors and wiring.
If the lights come up on the move, its the sensor itself, not getting a consistent speed signal from the toothed ring - might be as simple as being dirty.

To clear the codes, while in the "diagnostic mode" ie. car displays the codes, I pump the brake pedal between 8-10 times quickly about 5 secs and that resets the codes, and changes to FF ( I assume "fully functioning")
Alternatively, they will clear themselves if the correct signal is received and constantly maintained at speed.
 
#20 ·
Right Rear Speed Sensor

So I went to work one beautiful day here in Wisconsin with no problems. That day we got about 6" of snow and about 50mph winds. When I got in my car to go home, all my wheel speed sensor related lights were on (VSC, traction control, ABS, Brake). All functions were disabled (including cruise). I figured it would go away and it was just some snow. I took it through a heated car wash and it didn't help. Maybe it was water intrusion in a harness, so that probably wouldn't have helped. Well I decided to do something after two weeks and got it diagnosed (OBD II scanners don't work for this). For $35 he told me it was the right rear wheel speed sensor. Parts and labor had it up to $400 because its more that just unscrewing a sensor, it's built into the hub. I wanted to find a better deal on the part, so I delayed. Called a toyota dealer and they wanted $600 to do the repair. I got some info from alldatadiy.com and tried to get smarter. Was well worth the $15. After delaying another two weeks, it went away. No idea why, but glad it's gone. The wheel speed sensor TSB makes me suspicious. If you can live without the functions for a while (old school) I'd wait it out.
 
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