[Newtownian]

Does anybody have any comments on this new (ersatz RAV4 badge engineered ?) "Corolla Crossover"? Like is there any difference of any significance whatever or are we really just talking about yet another variation? A friend who I have been recommending the RAV4 to pointed this out as an alternative. I thought at first he was just referring me to a Yaris Cross which seems to be a RAV4 shrunken back to the size the original RAV4s used to be. (Not that I mind the Gen V gigantism as it actually suits me.).

The "Corolla Crossover" turns out to be a 'new' model that looks nothing like the ordinary Corolla hybrid - which is just the old Corolla with the newer hybrid bells and whistles familar from the current . Rather it looks like a trivially reworked RAV4 (shrunken in some dimensions by about 2 nanometres ) which in its hybrid variant has a 1.8L instead of a 2.5 L petrol motor and a lot less guts and a little less boot space.

To see what I mean if you havent come across this new offering here are links to a couple of amateur reviewers

and

The first is from South Africa who provides more detail and the second from the US which notionally does a comparison in 7 minutes between the RAV4 and the Corolla Cross. I was highly bemused by the latter comment "The all new 2022 Toyota corolla cross is definitely an exciting new model for the Toyota lineup " to which my reaction was 'Q'est'? in poor imitation of Fawlty Towers' Manuel as about the only difference I could see was the colour (Whoohoo!). Or are wasp Americans developing a sense of irony in response to the madness of our interesting times?

Some questions arose in my mind after learning nothing from these reviews:

1. What am I missing here? What is the point? Toyota are having huge problems delivering on existing model demand particularly for RAV4s. Here in Oz the quoted time from the Toyota corporation is currently running at 12 months. But if you want to get more details they send to to a fireside chat from the local general manager that reiterates what we all know. Just guessing but I reckon the real lead time here is now 14-16 months if you ordered a RAV4 tomorrow. Yet they are now spruiking another model midway between the RAV4 and the Yaris Cross and doing lots of other advertising of the latter and in general suggesting you can just walk onto a lot and buy a new car like it you might have been able to do a few years back. (The reality is you can get a demonstrator quickly if you are willing to pay about a 10K premium.....familiar?).

2. Should RAV4world including the Corolla Crossover? Or is a plastic badge on the car's rear the defining boundary between what is and is not a RAV4? (I'm actually not fussed but I am curious to see what passionate purist responses might emerge). Indeed should there be a section here from the Yaris Cross which nothing like the old familiar Yaris/Echos of the past?

3. Is there some psychological humbug here? - for those who who see themselves as sedate and preferring the Corolla - bingo we now have a new bigger car - while the RAV4 is left to off road hoons?

I'll leave it there and wait to be enlightenned.

 

[meeder]

Toyota may have a winner on their hands in Europe with the Corolla Cross.
There is however one deciding factor which will determine if it will have a fighting chance compared to its main competitor in this segment in Europe.

A huge seller is the Kia Niro hybrid one of the main reasons is of course the price but another big determining factor is that the Niro Hybrid is allowed to tow 1300kg whereas the whole Corolla Hybrid and C-HR hybrid ranges are limited to 750kg.
1300kg is a sweet spot for a lot of people looking for a more frugal car but still have the ability to tow their travel trailer during the vacations.

Toyota has traditionally dropped the ball on this completely by only having the, by comparison, very expensive RAV4 Hybrid AWD available which in some trim levels costs over 50% more than the Niro for example.

If towing isn't an issue in different countries than the Corolla Cross would be a great car. But if they don't get their act together for Europe it will still sell but they will keep losing to the competition.

 

[Newtownian]

Fair point. Its why I bought the AWD hybrid. However it wasnt that much more than what I would expect to pay for this Corolla Cross judging by the the cost of the Yaris hybrid AWD which though smaller and cant tow is only about 6000 AWD less than what we paid.

 

[AlexRav4xse]

I would describe it as a cheaper and slower version of the rav4 with less interior room and features.

Best part is you can get it for under $30k.

For me personally it's biggest issue is it's just way too slow. 0 to 60 in 9 seconds is really bad.

Great car for those who don't care about speed and just want a crossover SUV at an affordable price.

 

[Dryl00]

The corolla cross is only new to the US, the rav4 is bigger, faster and gets better gas mileage. The cross is geared towards first time younger buyers.

 

[Ermghoti]

Why not a Venza though?

 

[Skinny guy]

For me personally it's biggest issue is it's just way too slow. 0 to 60 in 9 seconds is really bad.

Some countries have RAV4 with 2.0 and CVT

 

[FKHeath]

They had a Corolla cross on display at the SLC Auto Expo last month; I really liked it. They just started selling them in the US this year. The biggest competition here in the US is the Subaru CrossTrek. Been selling them here for years, and you see them everywhere,

But the Corolla Cross does not come as a hybrid, yet. No word on when that will be. I would consider one then, When a hybrid comes, that should solve the slowness issue and give a boost to fuel economy as well.

 

[meeder]

Fair point. Its why I bought the AWD hybrid. However it wasnt that much more than what I would expect to pay for this Corolla Cross judging by the the cost of the Yaris hybrid AWD which though smaller and cant tow is only about 6000 AWD less than what we paid.

The price difference will greatly vary between countries I guess.
I live in the Netherlands and car prices are getting out of control here.

My 2019 Corolla Touring Sports 1.8 hybrid in the so called Executive trim had a list price of €35k, now in 2022 it has a list price of €40k. The cheapest trim the Corolla hybrid hatchback is €28k.

The cheapest RAV4 hybrid AWD will set you back €48k and a Prime €50k.

To convert € to $ you can multiply it by 1.13 as of today.

 

[Newtownian]

Thanks Guys - reactions

• Those Dutch prices are horrific! And I thought ours were getting bad. Interesting that the Prime is only a little more. Does that reflect the discounts/subsidies for official EVs?
• Its clear from the South Africa video and Meeder that the hybrid versions are already out there, just not in the US market and they have a 1.8L Gen V engine.
• The non hybrid version sounds like the same engine as in the RAV4 non hybrid - 2L. I think I read somewhere that this can tow a bit more to.
• The smaller engine size might relate I guess to the price of petrol. It always struck me how in the UK the typical engines more generally for the same car say for an Astra were smaller than here in Australia. Our petrol is less taxed, though not as low as in the US.
• Related to this I did notice the slower acceleration in the specifications. Personally I think if I didnt need the towing capacity and internal space for carrying things I would probably go smaller still for the Yaris Cross which gets 4 L/100 km and so appeals to a petrol miser like me. Also I run all the time in Eco mode and flooring a hybrid routinely feels a bit pointless - that said its good to have the extra grunt if you need it which is never for me but different I suspect for the US - a consideration here compared to the US is that our speed limits are lower than in the US and they are policed. I know the eastern states of the US have comparable speed limits but my recollection from driving there is that they are more like guidelines (thinking New Yord and North Carolina) and 'normal speed' on the interstate is about 10 to 15 mph above the signage so there is good reason there for having the extra power even if the wind drag gets bad.
• Regarding the Corolla Cross being cheaper for younger buyers I will be interested to see this more broadly. It certainly looks to be the case in Europe contrary to my expectations based on a local Yaris Cross v. RAV4 manufacturer recommended price difference..... GXL Hybrid Yaris Cross $38,862 GXL Hybrid AWD RAV4 $47,623 . I suppose there is space in there - 5K for an intermediately priced car. Further to this the GX Hybrid Yaris Cross variant is 3K cheaper than the GXL while the RAV4 is not currently offered in GX form. These suggest that Toyota may be pushing the RAV4 into a pseudo luxury class while the Corolla Cross fits more into the suburban mum driving kids to school market. The majority of the RAV4s I have seen locally arent the basic GX like ours but the 'Cruiser' and 'Edge' models.
  
• One other interesting feature looking at these different specifications is the boot space...... not trivial. In the older Corolla hybrids - standard design with a hybrid engine included.....there is no boot to speak of - 217 L nominally - as the battery gobbles up the limited extra room. This was one reason along with no tyre and no towing capacity that I wrote this off before going for a RAV4. The Corolla Cross on the other hand has a more respectable 314 (AWD) to 390 L of boot space as against 540 to 580 for the RAV4.
  
• About the boot space the specifications seem confused in searches for the Corolla Cross with 25 cubic feet being reported. But this is 750 L so it probably relates to the capacity with the rear seats down. I checked 'luggage' capacity on an Australian review site and it came to 487 Litres which makes a lot more sense.
  
• One consideration I havent seen commented on is the need for some market+manufacturer combinations to reduce their cross the board petrol consumption to satisfy government efficiency regulations. I can see much here but who knows.
• I just found this 'Cross' forum for comparison Toyota Corolla Cross Hybrid introduced in Europe
• The CC seems to use newer lighter 'more powerful' lithium batteries now (? more powerful? 2023 Toyota Corolla Cross: Initial details )

 

[wishk]

Well, I like the hood line better. I find the RAV4 hood too flat, it hurts forward visibility for pointless "truck" styling.

That's about all the good I can say about it. I don't see much point either.

 

[Lowcountry Rav]

Its a fair bit cheaper in the US - especially if your getting any sort of options - XLE has softex which you have to go all the way to XLE premium to get in the Rav. 10 cubic feet less cargo space, but its a fair bit shorter so that could be an advantage for someone parking in the city.

I could see a place for it - the smaller CUV's for other manufacturers sell wall - Kona, HRV, etc. The C-HR never sold well, wasn't available in AWD and was more car than CUV anyway.

Personally wouldn't want one due to the CVT transmission, but thats just me.