i have a 2019 XLE and just noticed it uses 0W16 oil. I went to 3 auto parts stores and they never heard of it. Is this something new or can 0W20 be used?
0W16 oil?
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njscan
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Hmm...interesting thread thus far. Not sure what's left to debate however, given that Toyota is very clear about their stance as spelled out in their own documentation.
In the US: "0W-16 is the best choice for good fuel economy and good starting in cold weather."
In Europe, Australia, etc.: "0W-16 is ... the best choice for good fuel economy and good starting in cold weather. If you use SAE 10W-30 or a higher viscosity engine oil and in extremely low temperatures, the engine may become difficult to start, so SAE 0W-16, 0W-20, 5W-20 or 5W-30 engine oil is recommended."
Same engine, same tolerances, same oil pump, etc. It's almost as if, CAFE standards aside, Toyota recommends using the most appropriate grade/viscosity for your particular driving conditions and/or use case. What a novel suggestion!
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In the US: "0W-16 is the best choice for good fuel economy and good starting in cold weather."
In Europe, Australia, etc.: "0W-16 is ... the best choice for good fuel economy and good starting in cold weather. If you use SAE 10W-30 or a higher viscosity engine oil and in extremely low temperatures, the engine may become difficult to start, so SAE 0W-16, 0W-20, 5W-20 or 5W-30 engine oil is recommended."
Same engine, same tolerances, same oil pump, etc. It's almost as if, CAFE standards aside, Toyota recommends using the most appropriate grade/viscosity for your particular driving conditions and/or use case. What a novel suggestion!
From the Pdf file about the oil pump - Over the past decades, the automotive industry has made significant efforts to improve engine fuel economy by reducing mechanical friction. Reducing friction under cold conditions is becoming more important in hybrid vehicle (HV) and plug-in hybrid vehicle (PHV) systems due to the lower oil temperatures of these systems, which results in higher friction loss. To help resolve this issue, a new internal gear fully variable discharge oil pump (F-VDOP) was developed. This new oil pump can control the oil pressure freely over a temperature range from -10°C to hot conditions. At 20°C, this pump lowers the minimum main gallery pressure to 100 kPa, thereby achieving a friction reduction effect of 1.4 Nm. The developed oil pump achieves a pressure response time constant of 0.17 seconds when changing the oil pressure from 120 kPa to 200 kPa at a temperature of 20°C and an engine speed of 1,600 rpm. Test results confirmed that the developed oil pump controlled the oil pressure with an undershoot of about 12%. The oil jets were also stopped from -10°C. The internal gear tooth profile was also improved and reduced the friction of the rotor by 34% compared to a conventional trochoidal tooth profile. This paper describes the details of the design of the new internal gear rotor, the structure of the new F-VDOP, the engine oil circuit, and the test results. This new oil pump improves fuel economy by 1.2% under the LA#4 cold test cycle.
As I understand it, in hybrid engines, the oil is cold, which is bad, and so that there is no increased wear, such oil is used. Another thing is when the temperature is high, what then to do?
As I understand it, in hybrid engines, the oil is cold, which is bad, and so that there is no increased wear, such oil is used. Another thing is when the temperature is high, what then to do?
You keep the same "winter" weight (in this case 0W) and increase the normal operating temperature viscosity; for that there are plenty of options readily available, all the way up to 0w-40.
Yes, I think this is the right decision. Winter 0W-16, summer 0W-20 or 0W-30
In hot weather, hard acceleration 0W-16 is a bad idea.
120k load testing with 0w-20. That engine must be ready to blow! Someone notify ExxonMobil that they aren’t using the properly specced oil for the US. Clearly a bunch of rookies!
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0-20 is a-ok, as is 5-30. But, you can go 0-20 on every fill if the 0-16 you wanted is not there. 0-16, 0-20 is just gonna be for fuel saving reasons. 0-16, 0-20, 5-30 will all protect the engine just fine. If perhaps you live where it get's to 0F or below, then run with a 0
There are a few engines out there that need the newly formulated oils (6B or "SN-PLUS" oils) for other reasons beyond lubrication, the Rav4 engine is not one of them.
Don't even need a 0. The 5-30 for summer is a-ok. If you live in say hot TX, a 10-30 works, even a 5-40 would work a-ok.
I run a 5-30 365d/year. My winter temps don't go below about 29F.
You’re going to upset a lot of people with this comment 😂0-20 is a-ok, as is 5-30. But, you can go 0-20 on every fill if the 0-16 you wanted is not there. 0-16, 0-20 is just gonna be for fuel saving reasons. 0-16, 0-20, 5-30 will all protect the engine just fine. If perhaps you live where it get's to 0F or below, then run with a 0
There are a few engines out there that need the newly formulated oils (6B or "SN-PLUS" oils) for other reasons beyond lubrication, the Rav4 engine is not one of them.
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Don't even need a 0. The 5-30 for summer is a-ok. If you live in say hot TX, a 10-30 works, even a 5-40 would work a-ok.
I run a 5-30 365d/year. My winter temps don't go below about 29F.
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Probably so, but I know how the oil works.
It's either a debate, or it's RTFM and stick with it.
If we stay with User's Manual, run 0-20 now and then find 0-16 for next time. That's what the little black ink says to do.
If for whatever reason one runs 0-20 for multiple oil changes, not gonna hurt anything.
If for whatever reason people learn how oils work, then running a 5-30 or a 10-30 or a 0-40 (under correct conditions), not gonna hurt anything.
We can debate further than just lubrication, like how viscosity may affect oil actuated actuators, but at operating temps, with these high-volume passenger vehicle engines, the arguments to be had become kinda moot.
As example, if you go out to the garage and start your cold engine in 5F weather, 5sec after starting you Reverse it out and then to Drive and go like bat out of hell, i'd probably want a 0w there. A 5-30 will still work but I am letting engine warm a few min and then driving normal.
But to stay away from crazy debates on a internet forum, just read the Manual, do EXACTLY as it says to do, and know a little deviation from the inked words is built into the design, so no need to fret over it.
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use of 0-16 and 0-20 (over other usable grades) are based on 1) meets lubrication needs, and 2) used for fuel saving purposes.
"100+ summers" is not really good context. The system is designed to work at a controlled operating temp. Now, go look at the viscosity charts and see where they are all at when engine is at operating temp.
I mentioned in other thread, if the temp outside ranges from 40-90F, what's so great about a 0-16 vs a 5-30?
Show me in the manual where it says a higher viscosity may damage the engine and even recommended a higher viscosity under more extreme conditions for better engine protection. There recommendation is for better fuel economy which they are required to meet. In warmer climates you never need 0 weight oil but it would.
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Just run with whatever oil you want. No one else cares what you use except a few other anonymous self-proclaimed lubrication experts that parrot the same oil "facts" over and over again.
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Fixed it there. Once the consumer gets it, all bets are off because the shelves and internet are full of choices.
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Anyone happen to notice the service spec is "API SN/RC". It's not "SN Plus". What does that tell you about the engine? So if it does not need "Plus" then why 0w16 or even 0w20? Now you have your answer, and perhaps readers have learned something.
Btw, go back and follow timeline at API org, the certifications of 0w16 were not even done prior to the User Manual and engine bay stickers saying "use 0w16". Toyota knew that, and they knew it was coming in US, so now you know why the manual says "if 0w16 is not available, use 0w20".
Post #122 is a good read. The 2.5L ICE in this gen Rav does have a dynamic oil pump. The main goal of the dynamic pump and 0w oils is to achieve a higher fuel savings, which is mostly at cold oil temp until oil reaches normal operating temp. At operating temp, there's very very little fuel savings between a 0-16 vs say 5-30. The dynamic pump and 0w oil was literally a engineering task of "..... save every drop of fuel we can but still keep the package affordable". You also notice that fuel savings for ICE kinda moved from the "IC" part over to parasitics over the last ~15yrs or so. A boat load of $$ spent on oil R&D. That stretch of R&D is now likely dead due to heavy push to EVs.
Btw, go back and follow timeline at API org, the certifications of 0w16 were not even done prior to the User Manual and engine bay stickers saying "use 0w16". Toyota knew that, and they knew it was coming in US, so now you know why the manual says "if 0w16 is not available, use 0w20".
Post #122 is a good read. The 2.5L ICE in this gen Rav does have a dynamic oil pump. The main goal of the dynamic pump and 0w oils is to achieve a higher fuel savings, which is mostly at cold oil temp until oil reaches normal operating temp. At operating temp, there's very very little fuel savings between a 0-16 vs say 5-30. The dynamic pump and 0w oil was literally a engineering task of "..... save every drop of fuel we can but still keep the package affordable". You also notice that fuel savings for ICE kinda moved from the "IC" part over to parasitics over the last ~15yrs or so. A boat load of $$ spent on oil R&D. That stretch of R&D is now likely dead due to heavy push to EVs.
I ran 0w 20 last summer and am running it this summer In my '19 LE. Got great gas mileage then and getting it now. Pretty much always above 35 mpg and often 39, 40, sometimes 41. Last summer got around 39 or 40 mpg on 200 mile road trip. I do run higher tire pressures than the door pillar states, like 38 psi, I expect that helps, and still under max pressure on tire.
Why would I run 0w-16 during the hot months to wring out a pittance of extra mpg? Of course, with gas just now hitting $5/gal in VA, maybe I could be persuaded to change my mind. Nah, not likely... I'll probably have to start walking everywhere I go soon.
Why would I run 0w-16 during the hot months to wring out a pittance of extra mpg? Of course, with gas just now hitting $5/gal in VA, maybe I could be persuaded to change my mind. Nah, not likely... I'll probably have to start walking everywhere I go soon.
The difference in efficiency from 0w-16 to 0w-20 is negligible. Driving habits are always going to have the biggest impact. Toyota’s usage for 0w-16 is fueled by fleet efficiency and CAFE standards.I ran 0w 20 last summer and am running it this summer In my '19 LE. Got great gas mileage then and getting it now. Pretty much always above 35 mpg and often 39, 40, sometimes 41. Last summer got around 39 or 40 mpg on 200 mile road trip. I do run higher tire pressures than the door pillar states, like 38 psi, I expect that helps, and still under max pressure on tire.
Why would I run 0w-16 during the hot months to wring out a pittance of extra mpg? Of course, with gas just now hitting $5/gal in VA, maybe I could be persuaded to change my mind. Nah, not likely... I'll probably have to start walking everywhere I go soon.
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I use whatever oil is on sale. Usually 5w-30. Always getting 40+ mpg. I'm not worried about CAFE standards, what the OM says, or the engine wear caused by the frequent start/stop cycles. Anyone that is is just a whiner.
I just saw an all time high of 45.1 mpg on a recent trip. Using 0w-20.
careful before your car explodes and generates a black hole!I just saw an all time high of 45.1 mpg on a recent trip. Using 0w-20.
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