[Bob K]

What if someone doesn't want all the increased assembly contaminants floating around in their crankcase for 10,000 miles? I sure don't. And if I keep this car that long, I surely will change at 5K max, and that means 1 oil change will be on my dime in the 1st 20K. That said, in my case, I will still prob. use one of my service visits since there is a good chance I keep this car less than a year.

Valid concern. There are a couple dozen used oil analyses floating around showing oil content in the first 20K miles. The appropriate question would be: are the "contaminants" of sufficient quantity and particulate size to cause any damage?

 

[Bob K]

Good god. I plan to go to 10K changes and just like the original poster prefer to do the first break in change earlier than 10,000 miles. I've done plenty of research, am a machinist for a living, and still prefer to get a clean change early with ANY new vehicle. We don't need your permission, or the snide remarks. Get over it.

KJPAT--In the interest of adding to the compendium of knowledge here, when you look at the used oil analyses out there on Gen 4 Rav4's, what break-in content in the oil concerns you?

 

[Bob K]

That's a good perspective. Thanks, KJPAT. I've been trying for several years--since the acquisition of my '13 RAV4, to base my decisions on science and measurable data rather than anecdote, wives tales, etc., so I'm always interested in the substance behind why others make the decisions they make.

A couple additional questions to help me understand your perspective. (I know you're used to seeing confrontational or mocking questions, but that's not at all what I'm doing here.)

1. Do you think the filter is sufficient to remove from the oil circuit any contaminants of sufficient size (such as metal particles) to damage the engine?
2. If contaminants are a concern, is damage done by leaving the oil in for as long as 5K miles? Would it be better to change the oil after the first couple hundred miles and then maybe every 1,000 miles after that until one reaches 10K miles? (If contaminants are a concern, I'd be worried about a burr, for example, breaking off at the 200-mile point and then scrubbing around in there until I change the oil at 5K or 10K miles.)

 

[Bob K]

Did you save some for a used oil analysis?

I haven't seen a UOA yet that shows 10K OCIs to be bad for this motor. Perhaps you have an impending problem with your motor if it's chewing up oil that quickly. A UOA would reveal that.

My Used Oil Analysis Reports at 5K, 10K, and 20K Miles...

Here are the first, second, and third used oil analysis reports for my 2013 Rav4 on Toyota oil changes. I accomplished the first analysis at 5,300 miles and the second one at 10,100 miles on the original factory oil fill. Vehicle usage was a pretty even split between highway and city miles. I...

www.rav4world.com

Used Oil Analysis, 11k mi, 2013 RAV4 Limited

Oil: Mobil1 0w20 Extended Permformance Filter: Fram Ultra XG9972 Here is the recent oil change from my 2013 Toyota RAV4. This is my first extended oil change, having just come off of the ToyotaCare free maintenance not too long ago. I'm not sure where the elevated silicon came from, it still...

www.rav4world.com

 

[Bob K]

Interesting. Do my 10,000-mile UOA numbers give you the impression that my motor is being harmed in some fashion by a 10K OCI? I certainly don't want to hurt my engine, and if you can tell me something that a scientific analysis cannot, then I certainly want to learn your secrets.

 

[Bob K]

I have indeed disassembled motors.

UOAs contain a variety of tests for the amounts of metals and compounds in used oil. That includes PPM measurements for the metals associated with engine components. Do you believe those scientific tests are capable of indicating if there's abnormal wear on specific components?

 

[Bob K]

I said it before and I'll say it again. What's the Benefit for Toyota to tell you oil will last 10,000 miles if it would harm your engine?

They don't pay for the oil changes! You do!

Does anyone really think Toyota wants to be know as having engines that wear out too soon ?

Why would you buy a car from someone you don't trust?

One possible motive for implementing a 10K OCI is so they can brag about lower total cost of ownership. Fewer oil changes means less money, and lower total cost of ownership may attract buyers.

Hence the reason lots of people have performed UOAs...to determine if Toyota is being honest based on mechanics and science or being dishonest so that they can brag about a lower cost of ownership.

Every UOA I've seen confirms that Rav4's pass the 10K OCI test with flying colors. Hence, Toyota's claim is demonstrably correct.

 

[Bob K]

What measurements in a scientific used oil analysis would tell me that my engine is being harmed by a 10K OCI?